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Seeking Truth, Transparency & Godly Governance in Calvary Church, Kuala Lumpur
This is a mirror website of Calvary Today
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Call to Calvarites
It's time to unite in our common quest for truth, transparency, good governance, stewardship and accountability in our broken and hurting Church. Until the above goals are achieved, this is what you can do:-
1. Stop Giving to Calvary. If you wish, you may re-direct your giving to worthy Christian organisations, Bible schools, orphanages, smaller churches which are struggling financially or non-church sponsored missionaries or missions work. However, if God specifically tells you to give to Calvary or you are uncomfortable about not giving to Calvary, please continue to do so.
2. Pray. Pray for God's forgivessness and cleansing of our Church as a body for all the injustice, unethical practices and bad stewardship that we have condoned or been blind to over the years. Pray against the principalities and evil forces that have crowded the minds and vision of our leaders. Pray for unrighteousness, covetousness and pride to be removed from our midst. Pray for God's truth and sovereign will to fall afresh on our Church. Pray for His healing for our broken hurting Church.
1. Stop Giving to Calvary. If you wish, you may re-direct your giving to worthy Christian organisations, Bible schools, orphanages, smaller churches which are struggling financially or non-church sponsored missionaries or missions work. However, if God specifically tells you to give to Calvary or you are uncomfortable about not giving to Calvary, please continue to do so.
2. Pray. Pray for God's forgivessness and cleansing of our Church as a body for all the injustice, unethical practices and bad stewardship that we have condoned or been blind to over the years. Pray against the principalities and evil forces that have crowded the minds and vision of our leaders. Pray for unrighteousness, covetousness and pride to be removed from our midst. Pray for God's truth and sovereign will to fall afresh on our Church. Pray for His healing for our broken hurting Church.
Purpose of the Blog
The primary purpose is to keep members and regular worshippers of Calvary Church, KL updated on issues and concerns in our church today and to provide a platform for them to express their views, comments and concerns and provide feedback on matters raised, so that God's will and purposes for our lives and for our church may be fulfilled to His glory.
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Many Calvarites will remember the infamous theatrical alabaster jar-breaking act of Senior Pastor Prince (PG) a few years ago on Easter ...
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We reproduce below a Comment / Testimony posted by a pioneer member of Calvary Church, since the days of Calvary Church's humble beginni...
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At the recently convened Calvary Church EGM on 16 Dec 2011, the Board of Deacons sought the approval of the members to vary the terms of the...
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For many years, Senior Pastor Prince Guneratnam (PG) has boasted to the world that Calvary Church has given away millions of ringgit to Miss...
Healing For Our Land Revival Meetings
Watch a Review clip on A Review of the Healing For Our Land Revival Meetings
or directly from You Tube Healing For Our Land (M4J)
Daily Bible Verse
Articles of Interest
Berita Calvary
Read interesting articles and testimonies in : BERITA CALVARY
The Bario Revival 1973 Revisited. A must read for all Malaysian Christians.
The Bakalalan Revival 1984 Revisited. Another must read for all Malaysian Christian.
Read about the church which borrowed money to build and now has to file for bankruptcy. US Church Files for Bankruptcy
TTG in the newspapers again. "Christian & Politics".
Recommended Blogs
Christians and Law Suits
Our Pastors often quote 1 Corinthians 6 as a basis thatChristians should not pursue legal action against one another. We must understand the context of Apostle Paul's admonishment and not simply quote the passage out of context. What does other Christian leaders say?
1. CHRISTIAN LAWSUIT by Dr. Paul Nah
2. CHRISTIAN INVOLVEMENT IN LAW SUITS by Dr. George Wood, the General Superintendent of AG, USA
3. WHEN IT'S RIGHT TO GO TO COURT by Doug Goins.
1. CHRISTIAN LAWSUIT by Dr. Paul Nah
2. CHRISTIAN INVOLVEMENT IN LAW SUITS by Dr. George Wood, the General Superintendent of AG, USA
3. WHEN IT'S RIGHT TO GO TO COURT by Doug Goins.
Letters to TTG/CT
Read the following letters and e-mails sent in by people who have identified themselves to us. The contents of their letters are relevant to our current issues, although we may not be in total agreement with the views presented by them. However, not all e-mails to us will be published.
1. A letter from an AOG Pastor
1. A letter from an AOG Pastor
Feelin' Generous?
Make a REAL difference in someone's life in 2011. Here's some worthy causes which you may want to bless and contribute to. Click on the links below:
1. Malaysian Christian Association For Relief (M'sian CARE)
2. FunGates SuperFlow Foundation
3. World Vision Malaysia
4. Asian Outreach (M) Bhd.
Malaysian Office: +603 7876 6789
The above charities are not associated with CT or the TTG group in any way but are examples of good Christian works which deserve our support and prayers.
1. Malaysian Christian Association For Relief (M'sian CARE)
2. FunGates SuperFlow Foundation
3. World Vision Malaysia
4. Asian Outreach (M) Bhd.
Malaysian Office: +603 7876 6789
The above charities are not associated with CT or the TTG group in any way but are examples of good Christian works which deserve our support and prayers.
Christian Publications
To get FREE copies of "OUR DAILY BREAD" write to : malaysia@rbc.org or visit : rbc ministries
To purchase books by rbc ministries ONLINE : Discovery House Distribution
ASIAN BEACON, a contemporary Christian magazine, has been impacting lives in Malaysia for the past 40 years. It is an important tool for education, exhortation and evangelism as it is one of the few Christian magazines in Malaysia and Singapore with a publishing permit.
Visit Wah Lok's website for a list of Malaysian Authors : Tabernacle Music
Recommended Reading
37 comments:
Christ never die for Us in vain! HE gave us HOPE of Eternal Life in Christ Jesus and a Life free from SINs and death. AMEN !
Merry Christmas to CalvaryToday , "Readers" with many perspectives and all Prayer Warriors on planet earth!
Thank you, Calvary Today and all who contribute to it one way or another.
May the Lord continue to guide and and lead you in all that you do.May His divine wisdom , discernment and favour be upon you all.His peace and joy pour on us as we celebrate the gift of Jesus Christ. Thank You , Lord.
My Spouse & I and our young adults (children),
wondered what could possibly be on the minds of PG & Petrina, Pam , Jim & Families, the Assoc. PAs & BOD as they looked at the Congregation this Christmas, and remembered what they did to the some 400 faithful members and their loved ones over the last 3years, and finally 'chopped' them off the Body of Christ in CC.
As for us, we felt a deep sense of sadness--having been married, raised our children and served in CC:(
What cold heartedness and ruthlessness, Pray they realised what they have done and seek God for forgiveness. Will they ever?
ROOTS
Am sure that the Lord feels the same way as you do......He is our good shepherd....those that He appointed to look after the sheep, hurt them instead.
Over the past years, they have subtedly 'axed' people each and every year....these only find out when they do not see their names on the list posted on the notice board just weeks before any AGM. No reasons were given for names omitted/deleted. So the figure will be more than 400 but 400 was
reported on major newspapers when they submitted a memo to the church leadership for restoration.
One thing is certain, our Father in heaven promised NO ONE CAN PLUCK ANY OF HIS CHILDREN FROM THE PALM OF HIS HAND,not PG or anyone as long as we continue to walk in the way of the Lord.
Can't say the same of those responsible to delete us from the membership list.....just because we want them to practice truth, transparency and good governance. If they are against this basic principles, where are their principles?
KEEP PRAYING FOR GOD'S WISDOM TO BE UPON ALL THOSE INVOLVED IN THE CASE which is is fixed for further mention on 6.1.2011.
The Plaintiffs wish to convert the OS to a Writ, will mean an open trial with witnesses from both sides testifying in Court.
I am eagerly waiting patiently for PGs and Die-Hard supporters to testify in OPEN TRIAL under Secular OATH !
Why the passion to bring truth to CC has died? Is pG finally win to convince TTG and CT with his cunning sweet words? Predictions from many seen come true...that is if the saga goes on with TTG weak on its approach, the passionw will died off and the sins of PG will escape as people tend to loose stim and forget. THis is so typical, another case where if you got hold of the church's stage, you win; no matter if you have God or not.
Sorry to say, but 'Anonymous 8 jan, 2:18'your view is
misguided. Do you not know:
God always takes His time;
His Justice is perfect
God is not mocked.
So,Take heart:)
PG and his BOD can continue in their ways, but already,if you bother to find out, CC is crumbling fast having been torn apart by their own self seeking glory, self interest, and draconian ways...
All those who stand for the TTG Cause has no anxiety, now you stay cool & calm!
NEVER JUDGE BY APPEARANCE!
Dear "REST" (9JAN2011 4:33AM)
Praise the Lord for your faith. Indeed you have entered the "rest of faith"
Hebrews 4:10-11: “For he that is entered into his rest, he also hath ceased from his own works, as God did from His. Let us labour therefore to enter into that rest, lest any man fall after the same example of unbelief.”
None of us who stand for TTG have lost our God given passion nor allowed our faith to take a back-seat.
Time does not control faith. Faith supersedes time. Time is involved in the labour process of believing. But as soon as we believe we have it when we ask according to His will.
Do you think it is God's will to permit unrighteous leaders to govern His Church? God never allowed ungodly leaders in the Old Testament and He will not allow it now SO LONG AS HIS PEOPLE DO NOT LOSE FAITH.
We need to stroke faith and allow His Word to burn within. Know you not that it is the trying of your faith that works patience. So let patience have her perfect work...(James 1:1-5).
I have put together another video in the Church Governance series. Part 2 examines Dysfunctional Church Board. The present crisis within Calvary could have been resolved if it was not for the dysfunctional BOD.
The video is at this URL:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S20wbpHqk_E
The members of the BOD are accountable and will have to answer to the Lord for the present state of Calvary Church. They cannot wash their hands and claim ignorance! Their only way out is to RESIGN, REPENT AND MOVE to the Lord's side. Otherwise, I fear they may be out of the Lord's favour! It was said; people feared the prayers of Rees Howells! Is it not time that the BOD feared the prayers of the righteous in Calvary Church! I dare you to put the Lord to the test and watch Him act on your behalf. We may enter the rest of faith BUT NEVER GIVE HIM REST. Storm His throne room and demand vengeance!
I have witnessed the Lord remove Christians who were an hindrance to His work… even taking them home before their times! So give Him no rest! I have witnessed this kind of removal thrice! Is it not time we see more of His POWER and ACTION in our midst? Away with the Baby Jesus mentality. Look for the Jesus who comes with a SWORD in His mouth! I wonder who is next on His list!
Vengeance is mine says the Lord - I will repay! I await in anticipation for the Lord to carry out His justice on those who have robbed His people. I say this because I have always wanted the Lord to prove to His people that when He says vengeance is mine - HE MEANS IT! Let us ALL intercede that Hebrews 10:30 becomes a reality and watch what He does!!!
In Part 3, we shall address how we may prevent rogue leaders and BOD controlling the Church.
Waiting in anticipation
Vijay
Blessed New Year - Let us hold on to our faith that Calvary Church will be returned to her rightful owner - The Lord Jesus Christ!
Dr Vijay,
Can't get into site to watch your latest video.
www.youtube.com/bambooconspiracy
Hi Bro/Sis
I have checked the URL provided above - it should work but if you are not using IE or Google Chrome Brower - you may have some problems.
Also if you cut and paste you need to ensure there is no space in between.
Suggest you log onto the bambooconspiracy site. All my videos are available at this site:
http://www.youtube.com/bambooconspiracy
You may subscribe to the site. This way you will be informed of future video postings.
Blessed New Year.
Vijay
Hi to all,
I listened to the audio exchanges between SP and those members who posed the questions. I do not hear the voice of LOVE from SP.
Pastors and Elders of Churches are like mini shepherds. They should be leading the sheep. God teaches us about LOVE in I Cor 13. Without LOVE, we have nothing! People will know we are Christians by our LOVE.
I picture Jesus as Chairman of the AGM. I picture Jesus speaking with the voice of LOVE. Who are we kidding? God is watching and we have to answer to Him. Would Jesus speak words of kindness and love or would He be rude and authoritative without reason? Jesus is Lord and He is Love!
I will not waste my time attending a Church whose Pastors show no Love or mercy for others.
I once attended CC and was shocked at one point with the way they celebrated the anniversary of SP and wife. It was so grand, done with candles lit and lining the pews in the dark during the service and the couple was given a holiday trip somewhere as a gift from the church. Was thinking to myself. Aren't they embarrased receiving all the glory and glamour and honour, being 'servants' of God? I would be sick to the stomach with embarassment, if my church members showed me so much drama. Jesus is all about humility. When I dont see or feel 'Jesus' in the Church, the service or Pastors, I'll leave.
Another time, I emailed Pastor Steven Kum regarding a problem but guess what? He stopped replying after I'd shared my problem. I asked myself. Would Jesus do that to me? No, I know Jesus would be there for anyone, anytime and He will not let us down. Jesus is Love and He never fails!
Just my thots:
A sister in Christ
Hebrews 13:7 instructs us to think of the good that comes out of our pastors and leaders' lives and follow the example of their faith. IMO, CC pastors and leaders have failed to live up to what they preach and their lifestyle is not one I'd emulate. Nevertheless, others may think otherwise. Like I said, it's just my opinion. For me to live up to the truth of Hebrews 13:7, I have decided to leave CC and by God's grace, I have found a new church whereby I'm able to exercise the instruction given in Heb 13:7. But I note that everyone's walk with the Lord is different. Some share in CC's vision of CCC. Some are ok with PG's flamboyant lifestyle. Others don't care where the money is going to as long as they are faithfully giving to the Lord. We respect our brothers and sisters for their decision. And we hope they will respect ours too.
Hi to all again,
When we give of our tithes and offerings, we give unto the Lord. Period. Unconditional. He (The Lord) receives it when it leaves our hands. Hence, lets not fret about how it's being used.
When men take our offerings for their own benefits, they would be stealing from God. We need not fight for justice. What could be a worser sin than to steal from God????
True, we must not condone the CC Pastors' wrongdoings and I can understand the anger this has caused the axed members. But the Bible does say "be angry, but do not sin". Just leave the unscrupulous church and maintain your peace. God is BIGGER than this problem and He will intervene in His own time and way!
Having read all that's been shared in the blogs, I sense that most of those expelled members are emotional and they have expressed their hurt and frustration here. Understandably so.
However, lets not forget that the $$$ (and everything on earth)belongs to the Lord. God is not a man that He should lie. We should fear Him, fear His wrath. What more does it take for them (SP & Co.) to see? Even if they repent and apologise to the axed members, would you guys wanna go back there and worship?
My suggestion is that your group (CT) move forward and not fight them (PG & Co). You have done your part to expose the truth and should continue to do so and exhort them of their wrongdoings. The decision to repent and change is then up to them.
We cannot condone sin and have every right to rebuke the oppressor. SP is acting like a total Pharisee and Holier than Thou, asking his members to sit, kow tow, behave etc...totally unbelievable and treating his sheep like 'dogs'??
It gives me the shivers listening to those audio tapes. Its just like listening to a movie dialogue! Only this was real and happened in a Church! They (the SP gang) were so intimidating to the 5 who stood up and spoke. Thought Pastor SK even sounded nervous when he didnt know his facts re the CARE and CARED issue. He sounded LOST yet defensive when he accused Lisa of calling him a liar. She didnt. She merely mentioned that the description for CARE and CARED was a lie.
One thing we (and even the 5 who stood up during the meeting) must know. We must fear no man. Jesus is with us and if we have the Truth on our side, we can be bold and courageous, even to rebuke the most senior Minister!
If PG & Co have surrendered their lives to 'serve' God, then they should be humble and teachable and also listen to their members at all times.
The same Spirit that raised Christ from the dead dwells in us and we can be bold. The same Spirit that was (is??) in CC Pastors will speak to them through their conscience and someday, if they should decide to change, they can still repent and be 'saved'. But things will never be the same again.
That is why the Bible says to avoid contention before a quarrel starts. Things have turned quite 'ugly' now with the lawsuits etc and Calvary Church (even with repented Pastors) will never be the same again. I wouldnt want to go there again.
Why not CT with the 400 members move forward and start a new Church? I can see more leadership qualities and beauty in your postings than PG's preaching and 'high and mighty' attitude. Surely God is BIGGER than this dispute and He is allowing the members to be hurt for a reason...to mould us into being better people?
Hence, lets all learn from this experience amd like the Bible says, "In everything give thanks, for this is the Will of God, in Christ Jesus..concerning you".
We should all take comfort in knowing that "God knows".
I COR 13:
Love is patient, love is kind..
Never jealous, nor envious..
Never boastful, never proud..
Never haughty nor rude...
Hope PG and Co will learnt the beauty of kindness, humility and love.
Just "a sister in Christ"
SHOULD I STAY?
SWITCH TO ANOTHER CHURCH?
OR START ANOTHER NEW CHURCH?
When we are hurt, whether by:
1. The boss or another staff in our job,
2. The teacher or student at school or university
3. The leaders or members of our church,
4.The government of my country
When we are HURT we all ponder: SHOULD I STAY OR SHOULD I LEAVE?
In the case of VIOLENCE or BULLYING, the answer is clear – YOU SHOULD LEAVE.
However in cases of economic hardship, manipulation, control or even words that may demean us, the answer is not clear.
When we’re hurt, our human nature kicks in! “Fight or Flight?” To stay is to fight. To leave is to take flight. In each of our lives, there is a time to fight and a time to take flight. Our challenge is to discern God’s leading at a given time. We must learn to hear God.
To discern God’s leading, we must acknowledge the motives within our “fight or flight” reaction. “Fight or flight” is a question about our environment. What we’re really asking is: Am I safe here? Just asking the question about leaving means that, to some degree, we don’t feel safe.
Just because we don’t feel safe, does not necessarily mean that’s the truth about our situation.
The ultimate truth is that God is always with us, no matter what our circumstances! As we trust God with our journey, we learn to move beyond our “fight or flight” reaction.
Now that we trust God, we’re able to start asking different questions. When we’re in “fight or flight” mode, we’re essentially asking God: Should I do this or should I do that? This is a close-ended question.
Trusting God requires that we ask open-ended questions. An open-ended dialogue with God will help you identify the more critical issues surrounding your hurtful experience. We must ask God the more difficult and risky questions, such as: What is God saying to me in the midst of this situation?
Remember, Jesus said, “the Kingdom of God is within you.” Your circumstances don’t determine your peace, joy and hope. First find your peace in God, and then make your “fight or flight” decision.
If you choose to leave, leave because you’re following God’s leading. If you choose to stay, stay because you’re following God’s leading.
To some He says, “Leave and seek REFUGE elsewhere for a while until the situation improves”. However, to others He may say –“Stay for I need a remnant to intercede and execute my purposes”.
In the story of the potter and the clay, The potter represents the Lord. On His wheel He has worked to produce a vessel of honour. Yet while in His capable hands, He discovers that His precious vessel, CALVARY CHURCH is marred! Being an experienced potter, He would have tried to repair the vessel if possible, and perhaps He tried several times. But if the vessel could not be repaired, his only option, while the clay way still pliable, was to reduce the clay back to a lump to be RE-WORKED again into yet another vessel.
BUT HE DID NOT THROW THE CLAY AWAY and begin with an entirely new lump. NO HE SIMPLY re-shaped and re-formed the original vessel until none of its impurities remained. The only direct similarity between the first vessel and the second was that this time the MATERIAL WAS BEING PURIFIED IN THE FURNACE OF AFFLICTION TO BE REFASHIONED INTO A RENEWED CALVARY CHURCH!
Others may have a different vision of Calvary Church – that is OK.
However this is the vision some of us have – because we believe that starting another Calvary Church will mean that God throw the clay away!
No!!!!
HE REFASHIONED THE CLAY IN THE FIRE OF AFFLICTION FOR A GREATER PURPOSE – TO RAISE THE SPIRITUAL BAROMETER IN MALAYSIA AND CLEANSE HIS CHURCH. THE LATTER DAYS OF CALVARY CHURCH WILL BE GREATER THAN THE FORMER!
Vijay
Does God Hold Us Accountable How We Invest His Blessings?
Is it true that when our tithes and offerings leave our hands, we are not accountable?
Let us explore the Bible and understand what the Spirit is saying.
In the Parable of the Talents (Matt 25:14-30, Luke 19:12-28), there is a simple story that our Lord tells here. A man who is preparing to leave on a journey entrusts his possessions to his servants. He distributes his wealth among three servants, apportioned to them on the basis of their abilities. To the first he entrusted five talents, to the second two talents, and to the third one talent. The first two servants quickly set to work with their master’s money. The third servant did not invest his master’s money at all; he dug a hole in the ground and buried his master’s money.
When the master returned, the first two eagerly met their master, apparently delighted in the opportunity to multiply their master’s money. Both were commended as “good and faithful servants”; both were rewarded with increased responsibilities in their master’s service and invited to share in their master’s joy.
The master’s dealing with the third servant is a very different matter. This servant came to his master with only the talent his master had originally entrusted to him. He did not increase his master’s money at all. In fact, if this were to take place today, that money would likely be worth less, due to inflation. This servant offered a feeble excuse for his conduct. He told his master that he was a harsh and cruel man, a man who was demanding, and who expected gain where he had not labored. He contended that this is why he was afraid to take a risk with any kind of investment. And so he simply hid the money, and now he returned it, without any gain.
The master rebuked this slave for being evil and lazy. He took his talent from him, gave it to the one who earned ten, and cast this fellow into outer darkness, where there was weeping and gnashing of teeth.
We can learn spiritual principles from this parable on how and where we invest the blessings of God. After all our tithe and offering are derived from the income we earn from our jobs, business, investments etc which are the blessings of the Lord.
Based on the parable of the talents, we may discern that God expects us to use His blessings responsibly and not squander it. We are accountable where and how we invest and cannot hold this simplistic view that once the tithes or offering leaves our hands, we are not accountable.
Would you give your money, for example, to a drug or arms dealer when you know it may be used for evil purposes? Can you honestly say you have a clear conscious in such givings and you are not responsible how the money is used?
The parable clearly teachers us that if we invest His blessings wisely, the Lord will bless us with increased responsibilities in the kingdom of heaven, and eternal joy in the presence of the Master, Jesus Christ.
However, if we chose not to invest wisely and give feeble excuse that we are not accountable where we invest, the parable teaches us that such investment can led to condemnation, even the removal of one’s stewardship, and an eternity of weeping and gnashing of teeth in outer darkness, away from the presence of our Lord.
Vijay
PS: I believe many Christians don’t understand what Jesus said in Matt 5:9. "Blessed are the peacemakers, for they will be called sons of God."
Please see next blog.
Dear brother Vijay,
Thanks for sharing your thots but I need to clarify something.
Guess what I meant in my earlier post is that what we gave in the past,(whether knowingly or knowingly sowing into CC's supposedly wrongful use), was given to God.
Whether there has been a misuse of funds from our giving is irrelevant as far as we're concerned. We cant change the past. When we gave, we gave in good faith unto the Lord. God will one day convict the CC leaders for their wrongdoings. It is not for us to condemn them.
Yeah, we can share our frustrations, anger etc..pour our concerns with others who feel the same way in this blog, but it is not our call to condemn them.
To me, if the leaders of CC, after all the exhortation and pleading from the members, still choose and refuse to repent,then they would be classified as 'heathens' or 'tax collectors'. And they should be left alone for God to chastise and convict them.
I agree with you that we should be careful from hereon as to where we sow our financial seeds. Hence, it is all about the present and the future and to apply wisdom in our giving. It would be unwise to be dumped from CC and then sow again into their ministry (if you can call it a ministry). I agree totally that we should apply wisdom and sow onto better soil and churches, in present and future terms. But we need to let the past go.
Hence, when I said that our sacrifices and tithes etc belong to God after they leave our hands, I was actually referring to our giving in the past. God judges our hearts and our motives were right when we gave. Whether the Leaders have 'stolen' from God or not is no longer our problem, but for God to deal with them.
Also, the Bible commands that we love our neighbours as ourselves. God doesn't teach us to love others c o n d i t i o n a l l y. So, even if our enemies are evil, we are still to love them. When we rebuke the oppressors and exhort them of their wrongdoings, it is done out of our love for them, that they would repent and do greater things for God in the future.
Afterall, if Jesus could still pray to God for forgiveness for those who crucifed Him, saying 'Father, forgive them for they know not what they do..', then surely we can look through the eyes of Jesus and say the same of those errant leaders of CC.
Let's picture a family of few siblings. If one of the siblings commits an offence against the father (eg stealing from him), the other siblings can only encourage and help him see his errors. But they can't coerce or force him as the willingness to change has to come from the offending person's own will and heart.
It will be up to the father to 'punish' and deal and correct him. A father who loves, corrects and the same is with our Father in Heaven.
Same scenario here. It cannot be disputed that the CC leaders have gone overboard and mistreated the members, even perhaps 'stealing' from God. But it will be up to God to correct them. But even should that happen and they repent, would the whole lot of 400 memebrs want to return and sit under the same ministry of those 'repented' leaders? Or are you guys hoping to revamp the whole Church leadership?
As for the other existing die-hard members or even new members of CC who might still be falling prey to PG & Co, once again, we cant save the world. There are many counterfeit Churches around and people are being wronged everywhere.
But I'd like to perceive it this way. That our God is a good God who loves His people. If the vulnerable ones get cheated, God will recompense to them what is taken from them. God loves us too much to see us being victims to others and He will surely intervene.
Lastly, faith, hope, love and the greatest is Love.
Just sharing my humble thots once again..:)
God bless,
sis in Christ
Hi to all,
Lets forget CC for a while, shall we?
Just wanna share this article with you all that I found to be really insightful.
http://www.bible-knowledge.com/fruits-of-the-holy-spirit/
It is about the 9 fruits of the Holy Spirit.
“But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness, self-control.” (Galatians 5:22)
It says in the article that the word “Spirit” is with a capital “S” – which means these 9 fruits are coming directly from the Holy Spirit, not from us !!
Wow, what a revelation..(at least to me)..
These 9 fruits are major fruits and qualities that are coming direct from God Himself – and every Christian should do the best they can to work with the Holy Spirit in getting all 9 of these fruits worked into their personality.
Hope you will all be blessed reading this article..:)
In Him,
Sis in Christ
Hi Sis in Christ.
CONTINUE TO BE A PETER AND WALK ON WATER!
I always admire those who enter into debate on spiritual truth because that is one way we can enrich ourselves. We learn spiritual truth only as we apply/share (debate) them and let the Holy Spirit (which is the Spirit of Truth) teach us by His revelation.
By listening to what others have to say, we explore solutions to problems and not sweep them under the carpet because although it is out of sight but we know it is till there (i.e. - not out of mind).
Peacemakers debate/dialog, peacekeepers dictate/monolog (see next blog for clarification)
Continue to be a "Peter" and WALK ON WATER while others sit inside the boat within their comfort zone. Only Peter was brave enough to step out of the boat and that is one reason God gave Him the keys to the Kingdom of Heaven (Matt 16:19.
May the Lord continue to enrich you.
Vijay.
CT had obeyed the Lord and pointed out "many negative inconsistencies " in the CC & CCC Accountability issues ever since 1992! CT had done well on her part via Legal avenues "as a Last resort" to put things RIGHT in its Correct Perspective!
Do you think PGs is really immune from Prosecution for " ALLEGED OFFENCES " under the secular Law of the Penal Code ? The past & present BOD & Elders are also "Vicarously liable for PGs ALLEGED Negative Connotations "! There is simply no Time - Bar for any criminal offences!
Let's FAST and PRAY for Wisdom, Peace and Tranquility to prevail in CC , in all Churches in Malaysia and in all Countries on Planet Earth !
Dear brother Vijay,
First and foremost, I am just an ordinary Christian and have not studied Theology nor been to any special training on Christianity. Hence, I can only share my humble thots on what I've learned from reading and hearing God's Word.
To me, the 'walking on the water' parable teaches us about having TOTAL,UNWAVERING faith in Jesus. If we do not have TOTAL faith in Him, we will, firstly not step out of our 'boats' and secondly, even if we do step out, we may waver halfway and fall.
The parable teaches us to trust in Jesus when we face trials and tribulations and when making important decisions in our lives.
Honestly, I do not see what this parable has to do with the actions taken against the CC Pastors. God says vengeance is His. Are we just justifying our acts by claiming that parable from the Bible??
What would Jesus do if He was in our shoes??
Perhaps some of the other brethren reading this may wanna share their thots and input on this subject..:)
God bless,
Sis in Christ
ARE YOU A PEACEKEEPER OR PEACEMAKER?
Matt 5:9. "Blessed are the peacemakers, for they will be called sons of God."
Being a peacemaker is not the same as being a peacekeeper. Making peace does not mean you try to keep everybody happy. A peacemaker does not say YES to everybody and everything. A peacemaker builds his/her character on truth, righteousness and justice. We can create true peace if we are at peace with God. Peacemakers are also those who try to make peace even if they fail.
On the other hand, if you are a keeper of peace you will try to keep everybody happy whatever the cost, EVEN IF IT MEANS GOING AGAINST GOD. The world is full of peace keepers. What God is building is an army of peacemakers – not peacekeepers!
Conflict theorists often use three terms--peacekeeping, peacemaking, and peacebuilding-- that are easily confused. Peacekeeping means keeping people from attacking each other by putting some kind of barrier between them. Often this barrier is made up of neutral soldiers--peacekeepers--from the UN or a group of neutral nations. The soldiers do nothing to settle the disputant's differences or help negotiate a peace agreement--they simply keep the two sides apart.
This is what I fear some of the bloggers are trying to promote – peacekeeping!
However, peacemaking is the process of forging a settlement between the disputing parties. While this can be done in direct negotiations with just the two disputants, it is often also done with a third-party mediator, who assists with process and communication problems, and helps the parties work effectively together to draft a workable peace accord.
I know the TTG and others have tried to be peacemakers but it appears the present leadership of Calvary Church is not prepared to resolve the issue.
Nevertheless, peacemaking is not the final step in the peace process. As both the situations in the Middle East and Bosnia so well demonstrate, it takes more than a peace accord to bring peace to a region. The peace accord is just a beginning, which must be followed by long-term peacebuilding--the process of normalizing relations and reconciling differences between all the citizens of the warring factions.
I look forward to the day when all in Calvary Church will wash the feet of one another and love so abound that the latter Calvary Church will be more glorious than the former.
My prayers is more people will discern rightly the problems within Calvary Church and one by one take appropriate steps to become peacemakers – not peacekeepers.
It is easier to be a peacekeeper. However, it is costly to be a peacemaker. Are you willing to pay the price?
Vijay
The 'sister-in-Christ' sounded very much like one of the members of CC's BOD, who always used "Let God be God" in her replies to my many requests to seek her to do somethings about the many problems faced by the members as far back as 2008.I am still waiting for an answer to why my name disappeared from the voting list last year before the AGM,always telling me being a member in CC was a previlege.
I am still wondering what kind of previlages I had when I wasn't even allow to speak up on the wrong happenings in CC, with the intention of righting the wrongs.
The BOD as well as the pastors expect me to blindly give and give and give while I was told to 'jump into the lake', 'take the next bus','go form another church', 'the church cannot be transparent like the secular world','in the body of Christ, the hand cannot tell the head what to do','cannot touch God's anointed', 'God does not need your money', 'thou shall not judge', etc. I got all these either from the pulpit or in prayer-meetings from pastors and leaders.
I had been giving one way or another to the church until my name disappeared from membership list.I supported the carnivals by purchasing the coupons and gave them away.Do I have to tell BOD when I give?
Look at the new list of requirements for membership in Calvary Church slip in the Calvary News for Jan. and Feb.The demands are many.As far as I am concerned, I have kept most of them, why was my name removed?
Quothing from the slip, under 'What membership means in Calvary Church',"For us (the BOD), to be a member of the Church is a great privilege and responsibility."
I would like to point out, it is indeed a great 'responsibility' to be a member of any church, but in CC, 'previlege'is not what you get.
I wonder if the BOD and pastors in CC are given a list of requirements for themselves as they do to members? Or 'are they the untoucheable, the unteachable, the only anointed!'?
What about PG's and the BOD's responsibilities; to be accountable and transparent? In fact things have gone from bad to worse. Now they won't even let you know what they are obliged to let you know when they take your money. More non information and disinformation as ever. Do you know how much work was done by Nam Fatt? How much was paid? How was the settlement done? What about the two new contracts? The contract sums and the exact scope of work? How are they going to finance the project to completion? The members' loan raised fell far short of expectation. A member who had given millions is planning to sue for his money back. He was induced to give under false pretenses. They won't tell you anything lest you start having questions in your mind. Ignorance is bliss.
What happened to the Constitution Review Committee? To appease the concerned members PG set up the committee with no real intention to make any changes. After sacking the 400 he did not need to make any changes at all. It would be business as usual. All threats to his dominion had been eliminated. What about the Financial Task Force? What a force! Recommended only three face saving changes. Is that all they can do?
A dictator will cling on to power at all cost, even at the cost of God's Kingdom.
Hi to all..
So much has been said in the recent posts but Jesus has not been mentioned. By focusing on the CC problem, I hope the members are not losing sight of the most important thing, their relationship with Jesus.
Hope we can continue to look upward to the Lord for continued guidance. Hope we can do our best to work with the Holy Spirit in getting all 9 fruits worked into our personalities.
When we can display love, joy, peace, longsuffering, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness and self-control toward others (including the CC leaders), then we will not be stumbling blocks as they are to us and to the secular world. Then we will shine when they (PG & Co) don't. Then we will not be sinning when we're angry.
But I know and have read all the articles about it being OK for Christians to sue others as a last resort. I guess getting mediation within the body of Christ would be the ideal situation. However, if the offending party fails to co-operate, then the only way is to leave them coz they would be like heathens..i.e. non believers and unequally yoked with us.
No, I dont believe it is OK to sue. Just sharing my humble opinion so pls do not bombard me with harsh criticisms. We are allowed to share how we feel here, right?
If CC leaders have sinned against God and against the members, God will deal with them and recompense the members even as they move on to where God leads. We have to pray that God will forgive SP & Co and not punish them coz their spiritual eyes are blinded and they have allowed themselves to serve mammon.
The Bible also tells us not to be overly righteous nor to be overly wise. I choose to practice simple faith. I do not know whether I am a peacemaker or peacekeeper or whatever. All I know is that we have to emulate Jesus coz we belong to Him and by calling ourselves Christ-ians, we should be like Him.
If Jesus can ask God to forgive those who persecuted Him, surely we can do the same instead of wishing the worst to befall those who have wronged us. Release CC leaders and surrender them to God, while praying for God's mercy to be upon them.
The Bible also says to forgive 70 x 7 times.
To brother Anonymous, I am not saying that to let God be God. GOD WILL BE GOD whether we let Him or not. So please do not group me with the CC BOD. I am equally amazed at how they (BOD,SP & Co)have abused and mistreated the Church members. I am on your side. But I know God is great and righteous and I wont box Him and take matters into my own hands.
What I am urging you all is to look at these (and all) perpetrators through the eyes of Jesus. If we can do that and love our enemies, then we would have everything. For the Bible says that without LOVE, we have NOTHING.
Finally, I believe that we should always return good for evil. Then Satan will not tempt us again coz he knows that we wont fall for his lies that will cause us to be separated from God. Also, by doing good to our enemies it will heap burning coals on their heads. (Romans 12:20)
God bless all,
Sis in Christ
To Anonymous posted 18 - 1- 2010
All that some Pastors care is about building their own little Towers of Babel. If you have the misfortune to stand in their way, you will be thrown out-with no regard to your past support or Christian maturity. Learn the lesson Maam. Christ is the True Shephard- not anyone else. These days they all have the trappings of a hireling to some extent.If they have wounded you-they just could not be bothered- not in the least- unless you are $$$ supportive of them and their so called "vision".Right now KL is full of church buildings, but with "inside issues' and with very little welcoming love.I find it hard to believe that they are actually worshipping a travelling carpenter who did not have 2 copper coins to rub togerher and was buried in a borrowed grave!!! Journey well my sister. Your expulsion is proof that God loves you very much to abandon you to the religious system. Perhaps your spiritual growth has been stifled in that deception. Now God can cause you to blossom again-by sending seasons of refreshing.Dont be moved by these religious demons- there are quite a few around. I will be praying for you- that God will bring new friendships and edifying relationships into your life.You are much blessed. I envy you.Take the next step of faith without looking back and journey well!! Every time you see their faces or hear their preaching, your wounds will be re-opened- So move on, my sister!!!
"God is able to make all grace abound towards you"
Thanks brother Anonymous Jan 18 7:15pm. Aint it better to leave a 'pseudonym' or name so we can address you better?
Now, you mentioned about my 'expulsion'. No, I have not been expelled by any church, much less CC. I CHOSE not to attend many years back, as I wasn't blessed by their services and didn't think the Church was for me.
I followed after my own heart and peace. Hence, my spiritual growth has not been stifled by any deception, as you so put it. I'm glad I'm not blind like those supposed CC 'heathens'. To me, playing Christianity and being hypocritical would be deceiving yourself. This is what some are doing and there are many counterfeit churches out there. I am so glad God is a God who judges our hearts.
I understand the anger that you may still be harbouring. But by releasing these people (CC leaders) to God, you will be free yourself to 'heal' from the hurt and abuse they may have caused you. Forgiving others frees yourself to heal. Prolonged anger can be toxic so do lighten up!! All is not lost. GOD is still in control!! It is OK they have wronged us, for they are 'blind'. But it is NOT OK to retaliate in another wrong. We should always repay good for evil.. That, in itself ,aids our healing.
Below are God's Words that are self explanatory :
James 4:
Do Not Judge a Brother
11 Do not speak evil of one another, brethren. He who speaks evil of a brother and judges his brother, speaks evil of the law and judges the law. But if you judge the law, you are not a doer of the law but a judge. 12 There is one Lawgiver,[d] who is able to save and to destroy. Who[e] are you to judge another?[f]
Do Not Boast About Tomorrow
13 Come now, you who say, “Today or tomorrow we will[g] go to such and such a city, spend a year there, buy and sell, and make a profit”; 14 whereas you do not know what will happen tomorrow. For what is your life? It is even a vapor that appears for a little time and then vanishes away. 15 Instead you ought to say, “If the Lord wills, we shall live and do this or that.” 16 But now you boast in your arrogance. All such boasting is evil.
17 Therefore, to him who knows to do good and does not do it, to him it is sin.
But we should also take comfort coz God clear says in Matthew 7:22-24 (New King James Version)
22 Many will say to Me in that day, ‘Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Your name, cast out demons in Your name, and done many wonders in Your name?’
23 And then I will declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!
So brother Anonymous, do not envy me. I am like any of you and we are all God's work-in-progress to what He wants us to be. I merely CHOOSE to not let the devil win here. I merely refuse to co-operate with him and fight with my own brethren but rather to allow God to be the Judge and surrender all to Him. Once this decision and prayer is made, it is a done deal. God has heard our prayers and He will deal with what we have surrendered to Him. Simple faith.
Hmm..maybe you think that I still attend CC. Hence you've asked me to move on and not hear their preaching etc etc. I am not in Malaysia and though I used to attend CC many years back, I chose to leave. I didnt feel uplifted listening to the preachings and could sense their materialism approach, hypocrisy and phoniness even back then.
My recent posts are just to encourage you brethren to let go of those who have hurt you and surrender them to God.
It is really a matter of choice as to what you want to do as well as your attitude in response to hurt. So, CHOOSE wisely now...:)
Guess I've said what I've felt in my heart to share..
"With Christ in the vessel, we can smile at the storm..."
Take care and God bless, all..
Sis in Christ
Calvary News Jan/Feb 11 carries an attachment on membership requirements.
Pls read it.
I read it - sums up with 3 phases
give, give more, give even more.
What I do not understand that for people who seem to stand for the truth, even if they give lots, their membership has been withdrawn?
I rejoice because when I asked Jesus to come into my life, my Heavenly Father immediately accepted me as a member of His family. He will never kick me out and it is my right because I am His child.
BOD said that membership is a privilege - is correct? Should they have the right to kick members out as and when they feel like it?
Dear brethren,
May the Power of His Love empowers us to love others as ourselves.
Be encouraged by this song. Jesus is Love. Am so glad we have Him and can emulate Him and love like He loves.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eA4narr2wyE&feature=player_embedded
God bless,
Sis in Christ
Dear brethren..
May those of you who have been abused and hurt by CC find peace and comfort in Jesus. May you maintain your serenity and pray as how this author prayed.
The Full Original Copy of the Serenity Prayer
by Reinhold Niebuhr (1892-1971)
God, give us grace to accept with serenity
the things that cannot be changed,
Courage to change the things
which should be changed,
and the Wisdom to distinguish
the one from the other.
Living one day at a time,
Enjoying one moment at a time,
Accepting hardship as a pathway to peace,
Taking, as Jesus did,
This sinful world as it is,
Not as I would have it,
Trusting that You will make all things right,
If I surrender to Your will,
So that I may be reasonably happy in this life,
And supremely happy with You forever in the next.
Amen
Be blessed,
Sis in Christ
The situation is very clear. CC leaders have sin and keep on sinning without slight of regret or shame.
Should we expose them and bring them down? Absolutely yes. This is not just what God permit, this is what the Lord requires us to do?
Firstly, to do nothing by claiming that you have forgive is a abuse of forgiveness and stewardship.
If anyone who has the fruit of the Spirit, he should take action against PG. How can anyone who know PG is cheating people's money with evil intention to exalt himself, would allow him to continue to cheat? Can you saw someone raping a girl and allow him to continue to rape? Have you ever think about the pain of that girl? Lisewise, have anyone of you ever consider the pain of the innocent people in public or in CC who are continue being cheated by PG, their money and trust? Have you ever consider the shame the Name of our God has to bear among the unbeievers because of PG? PG's sins are not just a past sins, they are continuous sins that keep increasing. He felt no regret, in fact he keep arrogant. To claim we have forgive and thus do nothing is negligence. How can you see someone rape your sister, and you do nothing? Where is your compassion toward the victims? You who know PG is wrong, yet did nothing to stop him, is responsible for the hurt of many. You should at least tell PG that you disagree with him, or against his many scheme of deception. Don't smile at the usherers. Tell them that they are wrong for supporting PG. Don't encourage project that fuel PG's arrogant. Make them feel ashame for their pretense in church. Tell them it is not ok to pretend to preach sermon dealing with sin fo people but not dealing with PG's sin. Don't shake pastor's hands as indication that we disagree with them. They should repent, not continue to pretend good.
Secondly, don't rely on the court case. It will drag and drag, but meanwhile innocent brothers & sisters suffer the deception of PG, while the hurt of those been sacked remain. Why then is there no healing for the wound of my people? (Jer 8:22) Personally, i think TTG is not doing well. In other part of the world, the wicked pastor would have already dethroned, as the Christian congregation is more fervent. We should have make T-shirt with slogan etc to bring greater awareness. Heal the wound of the victims and warning the public of PG's wicked schemes. Many African student and new comers know nothing about PG. We should tell them so that they could be careful. Stop the "rape" activitives of PG & BOD stop!! Rescue the victims, and deal with the criminals. Take the buletin distributed and tear them. Show tham that it is not ok to continue to pretend. Stop the raping of Christ's body!! We cannot go forward with PG's sin. They have to stop right here. Tell them, "Don't pretend doing ministry". Educate the youth, the young adult, the man ministry. Tell them not to be fooled by the material appearance of PG's schemes. Don't be impress by new TV or by contemporary service. All these are lies of PG to divert attention and attract support. Don't forget, we are Protestant.
All that is necessary for evil to triumph is for good men to do nothing: Edmund Burke
Eh? Previously "God's answer" for justice to be done in CC were the Courts and now "... don't rely on the court case"? I can only wonder why.
As far as we know, the Court case is still ongoing and it may be dragged on for quite a while more.
Please note that the Comments placed here are opinions of Concerned CC members, ex / axed members and readers of CT. They do not necessarily represent that of CT.
All exhortations and advise given by individuals here are duly noted. However, the pursuit of the cause of TTG is ultimately carried out after prayer and seeking God's direction before they are exercised.
This battle is not ours but the Lord's. We are only the tools that have availed ourselves to be used by Him.
Since Chinese New Year is coming, we wish all readers,
HAPPY AND BLESSED CHINESE NEW YEAR!
" NICE Christian?" shares
In his book entitled "Love in Hard Places", D.A.Carson tries to show some of the ways in which the love of Christians is a reflection of the love of God.
In Chapter One, 'Love and the Commandment of God', he mentions the sentimental view many Christians (he uses the word 'popular')hold which "breeds expectations of transcendental niceness".He continues, "Whatever else Christians should be, they should be'nice', where 'niceness' means smiling alot and never ever hinting that anyone may be wrong about anything(because that isn't 'nice').Further, he says, "In the local church, it means abandoning church discipline (it isn't 'nice')and in many contexts it means restoring adulterers (for instance)to pastoral office at the mere hint of broken repentance.After all, isn't the church about forgiveness? Aren't we supposed to love one another?". D.A.Carson ends the paragraph with,"So let us love one another and refrain from becoming upright and uptight about this divisive thing called "doctrine"."
In his next paragraph,he ends with a long sentence,"It is merely to say that the surrounding culture's sophomoricreduction of 'love', even Christian love, into niceness does not give us the scope to think through the diversities of ways in which the Bible speaks of Christan love, the diversities of context that demand something a great deal more profound than sentimental niceness."
Thank you, Professor Dr. Carson.
So, I ask myself, "Is the church I am attending, teaching me to strive to be a NICE Christian,thus lowering God's measure of righteousness in His Church? or to go to a church where I am reminded to follow the Ten Commandments so that our lives can be transformed, in His grace and with His help?
I rest my case.
Dear Lord, help us to walk closely with you in all our ways, according to your purposes and plans for each one of us, so as not to be blameless when we meet you face to face. Amen.
What is the request of the court case? The court case is seeking that the 2008 AGM to be null and the resolutions proposed by the concern members to be made available for voting. You see, the court case alone is not the solution to the entire problem. This can be seen in its goal itself. What about the 2009,2010, 2011, 2012 etc AGM? Will court cases has to be made for all these? With many concern members being sacked, while PG continue to “hire” new supporters of his own, do you think there is enough vote to bring the resolutions to fulfillment? And every times PG make a drastic action against the church, the TTG need to go a big round of court case and still unable to revert PG’s decision till now. What happen if PG keeps making drastic action? He sacked 400 recently and the 400 remained sacked. Court case ongoing, but before court case is ended, he may sack more, steal more, spend more, and corrupt more. How many court cases required?
The court case is only one of the things we can do, not the only thing; and the court case in itself will not enough to solve the problem. This is obvious and every moment delayed is opportunity for PG to plan to corrupt more. If he is criticized for lavish gym expenses, guess what? He now gives the entitlement of gym benefit to other pastors so that their heart is brought over to support him. How cunning is PG, a manifestation of Satan’s nature. The more we silent, the more victims fall into PG’s hands. In fact, silent is what PG wanted. If all that is highlighting his sins is confined in the isolated court case and this isolated site, then PG win half the battle already. In fact he instruct his supporters not to read CT site. All the Prince of darkness wanted is that TTG be silent and inactive; while he can continue to fish supporters and manipulate the atmosphere.
Have you ever think why pastors in CC preach so much about joy? If they are sincere about wanting the people to be joyful, they should go against PG and his sins. Yet they won’t, because their sermons of joy is merely wishing a joyful outward appearance or atmosphere, without true joy in the heart. They don’t bother if you are heart broken or saddened, they don’t care if the 400 members died or jump into the lake. They just want the atmosphere of joyful in the church, although is a fake pretend joy, in order that they can portray to the new comers and ignorance congregation that there is no problems in the church and that they are doing well. All these in order to cover up their sins and continue to collect money. So much effort spent to create an artificial atmosphere for wicked motive that has the origin in the devil – deception and manipulation. But on the other hand, the TTG is idle. The enemy plant bad seeds when the righteous are in sleep. PG’s strategic is manipulate the atmosphere so that people forgot his sins.
Today I saw an African couple gave an envelope of offering to the usher when they left the service early. This couple obviously doesn’t know anything about the corruption of PG. The message of TOTT is obviously diminished, to the advantage of PG. PG has succeeded in silencing TTG in the church, and new comers are deceived to believe that their offering will be used for ministry with pure intention. In seem like the blood of the 400 members are shed in vain. How can we relax seeing our youth manipulated to support PG? How can we let the dark prince continue his schemes in church without a slight of shame?
CT, why the good always have to be ashamed of doing good, while the evil are proud of doing their wicked deeds even in broad day light? Why the voice of truth is diminished to this isolated site, while the noise of lies can waywardly preached in CC? Why the deceivers are allowed to reign in CC without any confrontation? Where is John the Baptist or Elijah? Why the bruises of the victims are left untreated while the wound of the hurt abandoned till septic? Is there no balm? (Jer 8:22) Many are hurt. Why the hurt are always criticized with the demand to forgive, while the offenders who inflict pain to others are not asked even once to repent? Why the message of truth has to be spoken in secret while the lies of PG can be broadcast openly? How can we see our brothers and sisters in pain and yet we’re not hasten their healing? How can we see the marriage of friends broken due to the issue and prolong in sour stage, yet we relax? How can we allowed the youth, the young adult and all other ministry to be continue corrupted with the influence of the dark prince, and yet we never even try to confront them that they may feel ashamed of what they do? Why the righteous idle while the wicked active?
I am greatly saddened to read about the events taking place in Calvary today.Rev Steven Kum,and the rest- have you decided to sink with the ship? So you have decided to engage Zul Rafique as CC new lawyers.CC should have insisted to settle this the Biblical way but now you are engaging very expensive lawyers.You are not fit to lead the people of God. In fact I think you are a complete disgrace and
backslidden.Grrrrrr!!!!
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