First, they told the members that the Calvary Convention Centre (CCC) will cost RM50 million to build, excluding land cost of RM35 million.
Then, a few months later, Ken Yeang, the freemason architect presented to the members his spaceship-looking design complete with cherubim-winged roofs that can be opened at the touch of a button, a 5,000-seat auditorium with sunken orchestra pit and revolving stage, fully-fitted air-conditioned classrooms, office space, chapels, recreation halls, gym, dining halls, luxurious lounges and a huge basement carpark. All these for only RM80 million, Mr Yeang said.
But PG (Prince Guneratnam) assured the members that he can slash the costs down to RM50 million. The members were elated with PG’s assurance. Some even joked that if Calvary Church missed the rapture when Jesus comes, the members can hop onto the spaceship CCC and fly after Jesus.
Then, a little while later, they said that Mr Ken Yeang made a mistake in his arithmetic and that it will cost RM150 million instead to build the CCC. The members cast suspicious looks at each other, threw caution to the wind and took it in stride. PG asked the members at that specially-convened EGM to stand and praise the Lord. The members stood up and PG calmly declared the motion carried!
Then, a little while later, they said that costs have escalated and the RM150 million can only get them the auditorium with a lower quality roof and with the cherubim wings clipped off and the rest of the facilities as promised earlier but un-useable as they will be just “shell and core” meaning just totally bare ugly concrete rooms which will require further millions of ringgit to complete and fit-out later. They called it value-engineering. To the lay-man, it’s common sense cost-cutting! The members (the smarter ones, at least) realized that they had been fooled but of course, they were reminded to “touch not God’s anointed”.
And then at the recent EGM on 21 May 2011, they told the remnant members and the die-hard PG supporters (the smarter ones have left or have been sacked, remember?) that the construction costs has escalated further. It would now cost RM200 million to have the auditorium with lower quality roof and with the cherubim wings still clipped off and the rest of the facilities as promised earlier, still “shell and core” but now they will come with some wiring and basic electrical installations.
The important thing is that the rooms and halls may now be useable and all they need is to splash some paint on the walls so that it won’t look so dull. All these just for RM200 million and it is now called Phase 1. Phase 2 will be the completion and fit-out of all the “shell and core” facilities and whatever left undone. That will, of course, cost some more tens of millions but that’s for another day and probably for another Senior Pastor to tackle.
Another Senior Pastor? You mean, PG won’t be hanging around for long? Aiyoyo…. you’re so blur! The members may be foolish but he is not!
As soon as PG has had his glory hosting the Pentecostal World Conference in CCC in August 2013, he will surely and most definitely pack up and sail into the sunset to fulfill his calling to be an evangelist. He has told the members before of his calling, remember? He’s called to be an evangelist, he’s not called to stick around to clean up the financial mess in Calvary Church. No, that’s Pastor Peter’s job!
Coming soon: The facts and figures presented at the recent EGM
57 comments:
(1)IS PGs building CCC as if it is his secular PERSONAL Bungalow ?
Still treating CC members as secular ATM machines? Still calling US suckers & spiritual BRAIN DEAD ?
(2) If it is GOD's VISION for CCC, WHY PGs and Assc Ps, BOD, Elders had NEVER seek God's Divine Guidance to sell off their Bungalows & D/Sty Houses to part finance the COST over-RUNS ?
(3)Will the " Cost-cutting " measures for CCC ever get a "Certificate of Fitness" CF to be issued by Ken Yeang, the freemason architect according to the Architect Act (as Amended) ? Let's hope it will not be exposed to "possible INVESTIGATIONs " by the BOARD of Architects & other Statutory bodies etc etc on safety standards ?
(4)Somebody is seriously thinking of initiating a PRIVATE Summon to compel the AG to initiate CRIMINAL Prosecution under the PENAL CODE for the Possible " ALLEGED OFFENCEs " which were also noted by the last presiding JUDGE ! The " Best Evidence RULE " are seemingly overwhelming ! Pray that the BOD ( Vicarious Liability ) will SEEK reconciliation via an EGM on pre- 2008 membership list !
(5) Look like the Prophecy for Calvary Church is slowly and accurately unfolding right before our Eyes !
This is the problem when a boss with absolute power decides what he wants for his own glory and his cabinet of selected men and woman with blind-loyalty simply endorse whatever the boss places before them. Some token questions and some token modifications to show that they are independent but at the end no one really dare to go against the boss. The boss always gets what he wants. It is really amazing that these supposedly intelligent people can go along with spending the Lord's money in this irresponsible way.
Thinker,
I am regularly reader of your blog.
I think you all will benefit from the video interview by John Piper with Pastor Rick Warren on doctrinal issues based on his book Purpose Driven Life. I am personally very touched and encouraged by Pastor Rick especially the last part of the interview when he struggled with pride/influence after he became famous world wide. The video link is
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6u2RMyj-rxY&feature=BFa&list=ULrZHf_rU1lTY&index=12
Read the link attached and hope we can emulate them as men of God in their character and walk in Christ. They walk what they preached.
http://cellj.blogspot.com/
I have a message for the 200 CC members who stood up in support of the revised CCC budget at the EGM in case you happen to read this blog. When you stood up to be counted I trust you understand what you are committing yourself to. In case you don't or you stood up because everyone else did or perhaps you did so because you wholeheartedly trust PG and the BOD, basically you have just:-
1. Made yourself equally accountable with PG and the BOD in the event CC ended up in financial distress because of the massive loan commitment. In case you are not used to accountability, do not take it likely. Its a heavy burden to bear.
2. Committed yourself to give financially to the CCC project. If I were you before you sell your house, take a loan or give sacrificially (because that's what PG is asking you guys to do except himself I suppose) ask how much is PG and the BOD giving. By the way I mean real cash not pledges !!!
DO YOU NOT GET IT?? PG and the BOD have not been totally transparent with you guys. All this while they have been keeping you in the dark as to what is the actual cost. Today the figure is RM200m, 6 months from now it will be RM300m. In fact its already close to RM300m. Do the math...RM200m for a partial completion, about RM40m for the land and RM60m to do the fittings may not be far off. Ask yourself Brothers and Sisters in Christ, IF THIS IS INDEED GOD'S PLAN HOW CAN THE FIGURE GO FROM RM50M TO RM200M OR SOON RM300M. Do you not see the fallacies of this man-made vision????
COMMENT ON:-
"PG asked the members at that specially-convened EGM to stand and praise the Lord. The members stood up and PG calmly declared the motion carried!"
..............................
The above sly method is not unique to SP only but with many other AOG Pastors.Our Pastor pulled the same stunt too-when raising money for a bigger church building.After mentioning this from the pulpit, he shouted from the pulpit- STAND UP AND PRAISE THE LORD!!! the whole church stoop up including me and my family - and then he shouted -"the motion is carried"
We felt so used and manupulated by this devil behind the pulpit. I will not say much except that we are worshipping in another church now.My wife and I have to go out and work to sustain our family of 4 children.Sunday's are the only days when the family gathers together for worship - but the church stressed us out by constantly harping on $$.He even put up an overhead projector during the worship and all the congregation could see was how much had been pledged, collected, promised and on and on. And when he took the pulpit, it will take no less than 1/2 and hour saying how much has been collected to date and then " Lets give a clap offering to the Lord!!" The leopard does not change its spots. I know we cannot ask them to change- after all " Its their church!!". We decided to leave and we have found peace again- away from that so called " Gods anointed man".
I think the AOG Pastors resort to such methods because SP has shown them the way.I believe SP started well but the love of $$ and glory set in and now-SP is a manipulater and a con artist but his old stunts are not working because the congregation is maturing and has become more discerning.TGG IS PROOF OF THAT MATURITY AND DISCERNMENT.God Bless you all those of you who have had the guts to stand up to this high salaried preachers- they will NEVER MOVE OUT ON THEIR OWN BECAUSE THEIR BREAD AND BUTTER COMES FROM THE CONGREGATION- and God has exposed them for who they really are.Also a sincere thanks to Mr.Vijay
(whoever you are)for being a ray of hope and light to the distressed believers here. God Bless your Sabbath and the coming week. Bye Brethren.SAY NO TO CON PREACHERS.
Manipulating people to give is sin unto the Lord if the people do not give willingly with a cheerful heart. I think the best thing to do next time is not to pledge before you have personally seek the Lord on what to pledge and most of all do some background checking of the project if that is possible before committed yourself to it. Remember we are steward of God's resources. Let your emotion cool down first perhaps in a week time before deciding to or not to pledge. Normally this helps to make a right inform decision rather that writing on a pledge card right in the middle of a service as some churches did.
The question has run down to just one now....
WHat is TTG next step?
1. Carry one another burdens (Gal 6:2) by comfort the hurt and help in standing up for their right. United with true believers and share in the fellowship of His suffering. Comfort the persecuted, protect the hurt and defend their right.
Heb 10:33 say, “at other times you stood side by side with those who were so treated”
2. Be good Samaritan (Luke 10:33). It is easy to move on and let go…selfishly. But the good Samaritan would rather stop by and help the wounded. He is willing to help the hurt; rather than like PG who step on the hurt and backfire the stumbled via so called sermon, and still dare to take the holy communion.
3. Forgive does not necessary means approve. Don’t be silent as such portray consent. Be vocal to speak against PG’ sins. Disapprove his sins, judge and bind it. Put it into captivity in the Name of Jesus. Pray against PG’s dirty scheme and harden heart. Bring greater awareness to the uninformed brothers.
4. Use the God given authority to us to establish His principles on earth.
If you forgive anyone his sins, they are forgiven; if you do not forgive them, they are not forgiven (John 20:23). The authority is not given for vain. We are responsible to support justice, truth, and godly values established on earth. Don’t be a negligence steward. Rebuke evil, fight injustice, confront terrorist, and against hypocrisy.
5. Don’t compromise God’s integrity by closing one eye. Don’t let the Name of our God be mocked. AOG may have compromise. NECF may have weak in handling the issue, but the standard of God never falls short of His glory. What is right is right and what is wrong is wrong. No negotiation can reduce God’s standard or twisted His truth. Sin requires repentant and no less. There is no provision of escape to PG other than to admit his sins, repent, apologize and resign. This is the way. There is no negotiation of fake repentant. When there is no regret or sorry, it is not called repentant.
6. Don’t be a mute dog who cannot bark (Isa 56:10). Be a faithful watchman, for God is using some of you to bring about great revival and restoration of His church. Be a part of His plan to do church housekeeping. God is using you to clean His household from the dirt of corruption and the yeast of hypocrisy. And His work through you will be a witness to others in other church. The wolves (Eze 22:27) and the fox (Luke 13:32) who exploit and manipulate God’s people in other churches will tremble before Him when they heard how the Lord has uses you, for God hates those who plunder His church via many exploitation schemes and dishonest gain.
7. Tell the people to learn from present situation of CC saga. Bring greater awareness. “Have nothing to do with the fruitless deeds of darkness, but rather expose them” (Eph 5:11). Let it be a lesson learnt. Educate the younger generation. Make reformation in the church institution concerning accountability. Pray that the future generation of pastors and Christian community that they may hold onto God’s integrity in their serving and leadership. Bring greater awareness!! Expose the deeds of darkness!!
SICK (but clean) ARMY JOKE - ANY VOLUNTEERS ?
During WW2, the embattled American general issued an urgent request for a "special missions" team to be formed to penetrate/recce/spy behind enemy lines. Despite knowing it was a very dangerous mission for anyone (stupid / idealistic) enough to volunteer, he still went ahead to convey this urgent message to his downlines. Upon receipt from the dispatcher, a certain captain immediately called all his men to attention, forming them in neat lines facing him, with him (the captain) in the centre.
Clearing his throat, after briefing them about the need for volunteers for the "do or die" mission, the said captain asked, "any volunteers, please step forward for us to register your bravery and commitment." Some soldiers who were still blurred, half asleep or unattentive, raw, unintiated or plain dumb, suddenly realised all the rest of their "comrades" among their respective lines STEPPED BACKWARDS by one step, leaving them UP FRONT as volunteers for the cloak and dagger mission ! But to the captain, they volunteered - fair and square. No compulsion. No force. No threats.
Actually, none of them volunteered but they were SUCKERED into sacrificing their lives for nothing. The sad part of the story - Their deaths in the ensuing skirmish did not earn them any record for heroism in WW2.
So did you stand up during the EGM because EVERYONE else /OTHERS did so ? Or were you too suckered into standing up for OTHER REASONS, other than being counted as voting in favor of increasing the authorised limit for CCC project ?
Did you step forward or step backward ? Or did you remained in line ?
Beware of tricks by others - always be on guard against the plans of the Devil and 'bloodthirsty / deathwish generals'.
We believe a leader may claim to be God's annointed but if the past and present records his words and actions being ungodly, we think his testimonies cannot be glorifying to others.
BEYOND SICK ARMY JOKE - PART 2
We hope readers would see beyond the superficial contents of this sick army joke. We pray that those who are still "newcomers" to CC, be alert, and look deeper into the hidden message, warning about sinful leaders misleading the congregation. It grieves our heart so deeply that innocent "lambs" are still being led to the slaughter by the "shepherd" who was supposed to protect them in the first place ! Maybe the monster is in sheep skin ?
Can you hear the silence of the lambs ? Would their innocence continued to be sacrificed ? when would the slaughter stop ?
The "big bad wolf" in "The Red Riding Hood" would seem such an angel compared to this crafty wicked conman.
THE INSIDE STORY
All AOG Ministers are clickish- they have their own khakis here and there. These are the Ministers they will invite as "speakers"to their churches and church camps- of course they will get invited in return.If you stay long enough- you will hear them bad mouthing ministers who dont belong to their group.I have been around long enough to know this.
Of course some ministers till their own land and do their own work for God.But many start straying- the most recent example being SP.Most of them are not paid enough(according to them)maybe thats the reason why they start home schooling and nursuries.My Pastor started one because another Pastor had told him that home schooling is a lucrative business.Frankly, its a pity to see all these children growing up under a heavy religious atmosphere singing Hallujahs and playing tambourines.When its time to make the transition into the real secular world- suddenly they feel handicapped.
Then the Ministers who have been around a long time start imposing their ways on the younger generation.Only last week I came to know of a certain lady minister who was asked to leave because the younger generation were not prepared to submit to her way of doing things.When I called up the Minister she said over the phone" I felt so deeply wounded. I served all those years, and then I am told to leave just like that."
AOG Ministers need to take a lesson from this episode. SP thinks he is invincible.( So Did did the M.E. leaders).
I dont think this man has ever the humility to step down and move on. The comedy moves on. I have the feeling the last chapter is not going to be funny at all.
Voice from Seniors.
When all else fails —
when your every plan and scheme has been exhausted —
that is the time for you to cast everything on God.
It is time for you to give up all
confidence in finding deliverance anywhere else.
Then, once you are ready to
believe, you are to see God not as a potter who needs clay,
but as a Creator who works from nothing.
And, out of nothing that is of this world or its materials,
God will work in ways and means you could never have conceived.
Abraham didn’t stagger in his faith.
Rather, he was “fully persuaded that,what (God) had promised,
he was able to perform”
(Romans 4:21).
He recognized that God is able to work with nothing.
Indeed, our Lord creates out of a void.
Consider the Genesis account: out of nothing, God created the world.
With just a single word, he creates.
And he can create miracles for us, out of nothing.
Fully persuaded
David Wilkerson
I don't mind Pastors being clickish- after all birds of a feather flock together.What shouldn't be tolerated is when they demean other Pastors of their own denomination.This"better than thou" attitude.SP was never known to fellowship with the lower circle.Its was always top brass for him- and for many other AOG Pastors.They would never look out for Pastors with little flocks who are struggling.But if they see a bit money- then they will immediately put up another church building.This is the legacy SP is leaving behind- he has infected the whole AOG with this virus.
................................
May the AOG constitution should make it compulsory for all their Pastors to go and serve in the secular world for a year or so.This will put things in perspective and maybe heal their "Tai Koh" attitude.
How a shame-based Church works:-
1.Religious righteousness is used as a cover-up for shame and is dumped on others by moralizing and making judgments on them.
2.Legalistic, joyless ministry.
3.Performance is encouraged and applauded.
4.People become projects to be won or fixed out of duty or trying to win approval.
5.Members keep busy to numb feelings of inadequacy and shame. They try hard to be perfect and please everyone.
People are driven into the pastorate and out into the lords work because they wont to do something heroic, for which we greatly pat them on the back.
But the motive can be another form of performance addiction and shame.
6.Shame-based churches demand perfection.
7.Shame-based churches are always right.
Everyone else's doctrine is just plain wrong.
8.Members are to be totally whole at the moment of conversion. If you are not perfect, or are struggling, you are told to "grow up,""get over it."
People with a chronic problems become an embarrassment to the church.
9.People must look right on sundays.(no tie, your in trouble)
10.Loyalty becomes an obssession. Never notice that there is something wrong if it regards someone high up or in ministry. Keep everything quiet.
Follow the leader.
11.Religious performance is the measure of how mature you are.
12.Winning souls can be done out of guilt and shame, or keeping up appearances, rather than the love of God.
13.Money is raised by manipulation.
14.Nearly every service put down other churches.
Make it a crusade to root out doctrinal imperfections of other churches in the area, assume they are wrong, defective.
15.See God as giving conditional love,disciplinarian,hard to please.
16.Cannot hold and keep young people.
17.Pastors use fear, shame and hell talk to keep their group together, because without it, their group would fall apart.
18.The pastor is never wrong, nor indeed can be.
WE returned to our Catholic Church because the priest is so much different from the Protestant Minister.For one thing you wont find him talking about money to put up another building.But the strangest thing is this, come offering time they need offering bags with long poles as hands just reach out to put something in.And they don't demean other churches or religions.AOG Pastors are just the opposite- they are just full of knowledge and a powerful ego and spiritual pride.What a blessing it is- just to be in church, listen to the preaching and fellowship.I don't miss the shouting from the pulpit.Its just plain madness.
Time to move on.
REflections on
18.The pastor is never wrong, nor indeed can be.
.................................
They are the big shots in the church because they have been anointed with the "Rev" title.In the glory days of our church-there were many matured Christians with giftings.Then one by one began to leave- including the Assistant Pastor. But whatever the Senior Pastor says- goes.Whoever disagrees with his leadership- is shown the door.My son came back one day repeating what the Main Pastor had said over one of those teh tarik sessions- and it was a nasty accusation against another Pastor. My son is only a youth- why infect him with his poison?Anyway,its none of the Pastors business.He should be in the office doing church work.Is this what the church pays him for?? He started well but power has gone to his head- and today behind that religious man- lurks a Pentecostal Whoremonger.We left the church last December.His main theme- whoever goes against him - is being used by Satan. In the secular world- he will probably be hired as a circus comedian.Definitely tickets will be sold out!!!maybe thats how his end will be.
AN OPEN LETTER TO SP
Dear Sir, besides preaching , is there any other thing that may interest you? I heard you say at one time that if you are not a Pastor you would be a very successful businessman.Maybe you should step down and be a businessman.Do you find it difficult to walk away? Why? Church is the only place where you can collect money by talking? SP- move on.The water is simmering and it may start boiling soon.
LUKE 16
What is this I hear about you? Hand in your accounts, for you can no longer be my steward.
What shall I do? I am too ashamed to beg and to old to dig?
I know what I will do- I will meddle with the accounts even further.......SP's stewardship right now.
So Judgment is finally out.Looks like the case for TGG has been thrown out. So the saying that we can never fight agaist the system is true.Lets reflect a bit. During this whole sandiwara the AOG Council & their Ministers have been standing on the sideleines, with their hands folded and smiles on their faces.My Pastor wasted no time commenting on this drama. " The horse is made ready for battle but the victory belongs to the Lord... and so he preached on the following Sunday.How I resented the look on his face.He is another domineering kind of character.All the special speakers represent his own hyde and colour.Christian brethren in all the AOG churches- just learn the lesson from the system. One man can remove 400 faithful members who have been there over the years---and they can still win the case.Just get over it brethren- this is the reality.Dont ever forget- noen of the AOG Pastors stoop up for you---NONE!!
All those at CC- watch out for the latest deceptions yet to surface from SP. He is lying now for the time being-waiting for the dust to settle.It may have dawned on him that this is a new playground for him- not the old gullibles and vulnerables only- this time there are matured born agains in his midst- so he will tread cautiously.
CAUTION- CON ARTIST AT WORK
I feel saddened by the turn of events.Why did TTG lose? Did you not do the right thing? Not 1 or 2 but 400 have been unjustly treated and thrown out and there is no one to stand up for justice? This is a whole new revelation for me and my friends.Something is wrong within the house- and I believe it is just the tip of the iceberg.
During our last prayer meeting on Friday- TGG got prayed against to the maximum.The Pastor is behaving as though he is the one who has been vindicated." We pray against everyone who has been gripped by Satan to speak against their Pastors!!!"he prayed into the microphone.A few of us had the feeling of grabbing this joker by the collar and throwing him down from the 2nd floor of the building.
Disgusted lot.
In our view,TGG is very special. They stood up for many of us.They sacrified their time and money . They stood their ground even when the AOG was strangely quiet (NEFC included)on this eposode.May God protect them from religious demons.
Time to move on and get on with our lives. Life is too short, there are souls to be saved, sick bodies need healing, lonely people that needs us to reach out, prisoners,orphans and widows that we can touch and connect. Leave it in the hands of God. No amount of ranting and vilifying the CC Pastors will help now. The TTG has done well like the Book of Proverbs said "Speak up for those who cannot speak for themselves, for the rights of all who are destitute, Speak up and judge fairly; defends the rights of the poor and needy (Provs 31: 8-9) Read the Book of Isaiah and God will judge His people. Let's direct our energies to build His Kingdom wherever God leads us to those fellowship that is Spirit-filled, dynamic worship and biblical preaching led by humble servants of God. One that is ethical and reflect the glory of Christ and His attributes. For me and my family we have moved on and happy in our new church.
Thanks Anonymous June 8, 2011 4:18 PM. Your words are very encouraging.
TO STAY OR LEAVE?
A question that is pondering in members of Calvary Church is whether they should stay or leave Calvary.
This is a personal decision that one can only make after seeking the Lord. However, what does scripture say?
There is an incident in the life of Abraham (Abram) that may guide us. I share this only for those who have put their complete trust in the Lord. For those who know they have a specific calling, we can learn from Abraham.
Genesis 12 - God’s Call of Abram; Abram in Egypt
Abram in Egypt.
1.(Verse 10) Abram’s faith is tested by famine.
Scripture: Now there was a famine in the land, and Abram went down to Egypt to dwell there, for the famine was severe in the land.
Point: There was a famine in the land: Abram was not wrong for being concerned about famine and feeding his family, but Abram was wrong in thinking God would not provide for his needs in the place where God called him to live. After all, God called Abram to Canaan, not to Egypt.
Point: Abram, like most of us, found it easier to trust God in the far-off promises than in the right-now needs.
Scripture: Abraham went down to Egypt:
Point: When we are tested in this way, we often believe our actions are all right because no harm can come. Though God blessed and protected Abram even in Egypt, he came away with excess baggage and a rebuke from a pagan king. He was not spared from harm and his action had future consequences.
Point: The harm especially shows up later when a slave girl named Hagar - whom Sari received when in Egypt - is a source of great trouble to this family.
To those who are STRONG in faith and know the calling of God, the lesson we can learn from Abraham when there is a famine is to STAY.
Perhaps those who are called of God stay while their spouses and Children find temporary refuge in another church.
Seek the Lord and He will show you what is the right course of action for you.
Vijay
Dallas, Texas
The sacking of the 400 was not part of the case. The sacking happened after the case was started. The court of appeal suggested the 400 file a separate suit for reinstatement. One lawyer was not surprised at the high court decision. The judge probably did not want to wrestle with the rights or wrong of an abusive constitution. He took the easy route by saying that the plaintiffs have to follow the Constitution and exhaust all avenues before bringing the case to court. One consoling fact is that the court did not buy the argument that the plaintiffs cannot bring the case to court simply because it is a church which is not a legal entity and that there is a clause in the constitution which states that members cannot resort to the courts. The court can intervene.
Stay or leave CC.
This serious question can only answered by ourselves, both as individuals and as families. Thousands of questions come to mind. Should we join our old friends (we used to fellowship with) who already have migrated to other churches ? Would we feel comfortable in the new church(es) ?
Do we have to "hop" until we find the "right" church ?
Yet we hardly know anyone anymore in CC, with the "regulars" abandoning ship, and new faces filing in.
Can someone be concerned enough stand in the gap - to provide guidance, prayers and counselling to the lost sheep like us, still in CC ?
Will there be former CC members to help us be assimiliated into the new churches ?
Will there be people who help the unwary "new arrivals" appreciate the whole truth behind the failed projects of CC, C-land and CCC ?
Most of the sacked 400 have moved on to a few of the bigger churches. What an eye opener once you leave the restrictive confines of CC where an insecure pastor had made all effort to keep his sheep (or suckers) isolated from the rest of the Christian community. Have you heard of him supporting the events of other churches? CC did not participate in the events organized by NECF even when he was NECF chairman. CC did not participate in the annual 40 day national fast and pray rally. The men who meet regularly as CalvaryMen are from six different churches. I dare say all of them are spiritually healthy and thriving in their new spiritual homes. The pastors understand the hurt and the pain that accompanied them but did not hold it against them. Instead they helped them move on as they must. Most of them are not babes in the Lord. All they needed was a bit of love and care and they shall blossom. You can be sure that you will see a welcome committee of ex-Calvarites no matter which of these churches you go to. They have also made new friends through the new life groups and involvement in church activities. It is so refreshing to move out from under the dictatorial ministry of an abusive pastor. You will find a new liberty in the worship of our Lord Jesus. How refreshing when you meet a pastor who knows the name of everyone including those who just migrated from CC instead of a pastor who cannot even remember the name of his deacon. However, please pay heed to Dr Vijay's advice. You should stay in CC if so instructed by the Holy Spirit. But if the atmosphere is spiritually oppressive then you must leave immediately.
The question is not whether one should stay or go.
The question is not whether the court case should continue or not.
The question is not whether CCC will be completely built or not.
The question is not how CC get the extra 50 mil.
The question is not whether TTG should appeal AOG again or not.
The question is when will TTG learn that there is no other way, other than bring greater awareness. The problem cannot be solved merely in EGM/AGM. The problem cannot be solved merely by NECF persuading PG to reconciliation. The problem will not solved even by CC adopt transparency now.
The problem can only be solved by bring greater awareness, so that the public, the christian community, the foreign ministers and pastors, know the evil deed of PG, that even if he successfully built CCC, it is of no use to him to boast his own glory, for everyone know his sins. And CCC can no longer be a tool for him to continue to cheat and fish donors for more personal money. He will discredit himself, not to mention that no bank would has confidence in lending money to CC. Everything he has ill-fully built will collapse - his fake ministry, his white elephant CCC, Cland, his excuse to collect charity money...all gone, when God's people dare to speak up the truth plainly. No longer rely on prolong court case, negligence AOG, isolated website, etc...but speak up plainly - bring greater awareness. Until we do that, nothing will change.
A CRY FOR HELP.
The bro/sis who wrote this has raised an important issue.
"Can someone be concerned enough to stand in the gap - to provide guidance, prayers and counseling to the lost sheep like us, still in CC?"
I know there are some who have been specifically called by God right now standing in the gap for the situation in Calvary Church.
I assure you that the group I represent in the USA are interceding daily for Calvary Church. In fact, we believe the Lord has already predetermined the solution and will bring it to pass in His time.
The group I represent also believe that TTG/Calvary Today has done all it can and the solution will not come from the wisdom of man but from powers on high...God Himself.
We are currently interceding for the direct intervention of the Lord to remove the present leadership in a way that will shock those who presently support it. They will know unmistakably that it is the Lord who has removed the leadership and the fear of the Lord will sweep through the congregation and the leadership of Calvary Church.
In fact, we are interceding that the action of the Lord on the present leadership of Calvary Church will also send a shock wave that will also cause national Christian organisations to repent for their inactions.
Study scriptures and church history and you will learn that the Lord has removed His servants in the past and revived the Church.
However, right now there is a need to address the issue the bro/sis has raised.
HOW CAN TTG/CALVARY TODAY HELP THOSE WHO ARE CRYING FOR HELP, NEED GUIDANCE/COUNSELING?
May I suggest those who need guidance/counseling write to Calvary Today (CT) and CT forward the request to a panel of Christian leaders who can provide guidance/counseling.
Every answer will help many others who may have the same question/need.
The details can be ironed out later but as Christian leaders we have an obligation to help those crying for help.
Vijay
Dallas, Texas
PS. In the event there are some who are at wit's end and need urgent help. Please feel free to e-mail direct to vijay.newdawn@gmail.com and I will respond in confidence via CT.
Please note that I cannot respond directly to individuals as I only serve through Calvary Today. CT rightly deserve all the praise and glory for their work and we must respect the administrator of the blog.
However, for cases that may require long discussions, I will respond direct to the inquirer and e-mail a copy to CT administrator. This is to avoid cluttering the Blog with long discussions.
All discussions in the blog are under the supervision of CT blog administrator.
Agree totally with Anonymous June 9, 12:05am. The question is not to stay or go but to bring greater awareness and help those who are still blindly following SP. This was brought up by 'save calvary now' some time ago.
I am saddened by the fact that CT has chosen not to publish some articles by truly concerned Christians and day after day, week after week, the saga continues.
Anyone knows why 'save calvary now' has gone silent? I think he/she truly has been led by God to do something to help us all..
Consider with me one of the Lord’s parables.
“Again, the kingdom of heaven is like unto a merchant man,
seeking goodly pearls: who, when he had found one pearl of great price, went and sold all that
he had, and bought it”
(Matthew 13:45–46).
Who is the merchant in this
parable?
The Greek root here explains him as a traveling wholesale trader. This merchant was also an assayer, or tester.
In other words, he made his living by evaluating costly pearls for their quality and worth.
We know that Jesus is the pearl of great price that the merchant finds.
He’s very costly, of incalculable value, because the merchant sells all his other possessions to gain him.
I believe we find the meaning of the pearl in God’s eternal purposes.
Obviously, the pearl belonged to the Father.
He possessed Christ just as any father possesses his own son.
Indeed, Jesus is the Father’s most
valued and treasured possession. Only one thing would cause the
Father to give up this priceless pearl.
He did it out of love.
Christ is the treasure chest in the field. And in him, I’ve found all that I’ll ever need.
No more trying to find purpose in ministry. No more looking
for fulfillment in family or friends.
No more needing to build something for God,
or to be a success, or to feel useful.
No more keeping up with the crowd, or trying to prove something.
No more searching for ways to please people.
No more trying to think or reason my way out of difficulties.
I’ve found what I’m looking for. My treasure, my pearl, is Christ.
And all that the Owner asks of me is, “David, I love you. Let me adopt you. I’ve already signed the papers with my own Son’s blood.
You’re now a joint heir with him of everything I possess.”
Secrets of God
David Wilkerson
THE PRESENT AOG LEADERSHIP TREND
During my time as a young Christian in the late 70's,when the Pastor came around we sat reverently around the table as he taught us the Gospel truths and led us into prayer.Then there was this hospital visitation,cooking food for the poor,visiting people who were living in broken sheds by the railway with the Pastor leading, what a glorious season of Christian service it was then. He left us in the late 80's.
But now what goes on is the COMPETITION by Pastors to build buildings and call it churches.Maybe a bit of charity work to ward off the penetrating eye.It does not matter to them that it costs millions of dollars,and takes years to service the debt.It is the congregation who has to come up with the $$$ in the last analysis. But all these factors are irrelevant in the present Pastors mind- what is important is that we MUST NOT BE OUTCLASSED BY OTHER BIG CHURCHES!!That is the disease in the leadership today.
I dread to think what might have been if TGG had not surfaced.SP & AP's would be wearing expensive silk ties while the average Christian would be eating "chap faan" in the alleys.
But I don't think we have the brains to "kau tim" him. He will KT any opposition.Maybe TGG should realize that and move on.I feel greatly saddened by the Courts decision. But if the outcome had been different-there would be 2 houses in CC.And according to the Master-" A house divided against itself cannot stand."
A Brother Only.
How did CC ever come to this state of affairs. On whose side is God? Can't we all just reconcile and just get back to normal?? Why cant SP just resign? I believe he is hogging the limelight.Do you really need the spaceship you are building?
Visitor from another church.
I dont think I can attend CC much longer.There is not much clarity. I am looking around for a small church to attend-any help from anyone out there??
To address question by Truly concerned @ June 9, 2011 11:12 AM
who said, “Anyone knows why 'save calvary now' has gone silent? I think he/she truly has been led by God to do something to help us all..”
To begin with, we like to put on record again that Calvary Today Blog is a communication tool used to convey and report on the efforts put in by our TTG brother and sisters in their pursuit of Truth, Transparency and Good Governance in Calvary Church.
As the administrators have said before, the CT blog will not endorse any “advertisement” or “enrollment” for help here in CT.
We have asked the person under the pseudonym, 'save calvary now’ to write to the administrators but up till today we have not heard from this person.
We have reasons to doubt the sincerity and the effectiveness of the efforts and strategies as suggested by 'save calvary now’. We now copy parts of the comment posted by her which led us to this conclusion. Here’s her reply to a comment by “Chee Kee” in an earlier post.
_________________________
“Addressing bro Chee Kee, let me first and foremost say that I am a sister from overseas and I couldnt have possibly 'met' the TTG members or I might have done so. You asked if I did anything. Yes, I did do my best, even from a distance. I gave practical ideas. I started the ball rolling. I created an email just for this purpose. I wanted to get a group together to do practical things that TTG seemingly wasn't doing ...
So, please bro Chee Kee, I forgive you for your remarks and once again, I have extended my invitation to all those who want to sacrifice a little of their time and perhaps donating some $$ to make a difference.”
By SAVE CALVARY NOW !! on That “snaky” feeling again… on 5/5/11
________________________________
Firstly, as you can see from her comment, she said she is “a sister from overseas and I couldnt have possibly 'met' the TTG members” How can one organize meetings and make personal calls to those who would write to her email address, if she is not living in Malaysia, let alone being in Kuala Lumpur?
Secondly, our TTG brothers and sister would not ask for “$$” money from anyone, so her invitation, “to all those who want to sacrifice a little of their time and perhaps donating some $$ to make a difference.” is not consistent with the way TTG brothers and sisters work.
As we have said before and say again, we appreciate that many of you have put in comments giving the TTG suggestions on what to do in their pursuit of the TTG cause. Some of your suggestions the TTG have adopted, others have remained as suggestion here and may be adopted by someone at another time.
Anyone who is really wanting to do something should approach the TTG people personally or be bold and launch out in faith if you feel that God is telling you to do so. Our God will send people to support your effort if you ask Him to.
May we continue to experience the hand of God guiding us in all our endeavors.
THE CC PASTORS HAVE COMMITTED SPIRITUAL SINS AGAINST GOD. THEY HAVE BETRAYED YOU, CHEATED YOU AND HURT YOU, YET SOME FOR SENTIMENTAL REASONS IN CC WANTS TO STAY ON. DON'T DECEIVE YOURSELVES, YOU CAN NEVER BENEFIT & GROW SPIRITUALLY WITH THESE FALSE PREACHERS LEADING IN SERVICES EVERY WEEKENDS. IN FACT, YOU SHOULD REJOICE & BE GLAD IN LEAVING THEM BECAUSE YOU ARE SETTING YOURSELF FREE FROM THEIR UNGODLY LEADERSHIP.
IT SIMPLY MAKE NO SENSE TO STAY ON IN CC ANYMORE WITH THIS PRESENT LEADERSHIP. LEAVE THEM & LET THEM CONTINUE IN THEIR SINS AND LET GOD JUDGE THEM.
I am a new entrant to your blog and like many other readers of this blog, I was both shocked and dismayed that CC has got itself into such a pathetic state of affairs, as I once attended CC regularly.
Thanks to CT for highlighting all the misdeeds done by PG. It is indeed sad especially for those CC members who have grown with him through all these 30 years or more to see their “ideal” pastor becoming an unbelievable financial Dracula sucking blood from the church members.
It reminds me of what we have always been warned of false prophets and false teachers of the gospel viz:
1 John 4:1 (NIV): Dear friends, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are from God, because many false prophets have gone out into the world.
2 Timothy 4:3 (NIV): For the time will come when people will not put up with sound doctrine. Instead, to suit their own desires, they will gather around them a great number of teachers to say what their itching ears want to hear.
There is a need for all church-goers to constantly monitor their pastors sermons and church leaders teachings to ensure they are “sound biblical doctrine”, as even a pastor who has been with a church for 30 years or more can also go astray.
You can be assured God will not be mocked. Wrong doers will be removed from the church, existing members will be set free from that bondage and CT will be vindicated.
KT
Plainly Speaking,
1)The Overrun from RM50Million to RM300Million on
CCC, is an outright NO ACCOUNTABILITY on the
part of pG & BOD, and
2)the RESPONSIBILITY also rest with those members
who VOTED for all those increases time & time
again-- more loans, more borrowings, more
mortgages--without a thought to the
consequences of their actions, and what the Word
has to say about such methods they deployed.
Q, All of those culprits mentioned above, do they
actually put the money where their mouth is?
June 16, 2011 1:46 AM
(Moved here from previous post for relevance purpose by administrator)
If a pastor of a church is genuine, he should be more concerned about God’s kingdom being built that more unsaved souls will be added to the church and NOT building mega projects with all sorts of fancies that adds no spiritual value and do not save souls. How disgusting this is happening to CC with the wrong leadership.
God’s Vision or PG’s Vision????
Per CT posting dated Jan 25 2011, PG had 3 visions which he claims were from God:
1.Sri Hartamas Land (this was back in the 1980s)
2.Building a new church on the Damansara Heights site
3.Calvary Convention Center project
We are familiar with the scriptural verse Matt 19:26 (NIV) – “With God, all things are possible”. From this verse, one can conclude that even if there were obstacles along the way, they will be overcome though it may take time. Unfortunately this has not been the case with items (1) and (2). Thus it raises DOUBT whether these two visions were indeed from God.
Conversely, one can say that “With men, NOT all things are possible.” - (this of course is not a scriptural verse.) In other words, if the visions are not from God but from men thinking that their visions are from God, then one can expect the obstacles will unlikely to be overcome – which were in fact the case with items (1) and (2).
I was with CC during the 1980s and from the Sri Hartamas debacle, I was NOT convinced the vision was from God and thus I left CC.
To evaluate whether anyone who claims to be God’s prophet (be he your pastor or any evangelist) and claims his visions or prophecies are from God, the BEST TEST is found in Deuteronomy 18:21-22 (NIV) quoted below:-
“21 You may say to yourselves, “How can we know when a message has not been spoken by the LORD?” 22 If what a prophet proclaims in the name of the LORD DOES NOT TAKE PLACE or COME TRUE, that is a message the LORD has not spoken. That prophet has spoken presumptuously, so do not be alarmed.
TIME will tell but one does not need time and time again to tell us. Once bitten, twice shy is a good advice to follow.
I no longer attend life-groups but heard from one of the life group leaders, they are 'asked' to contribute towards CCC whether they beg or borrow as church is in dire need of funds for ccc.
This seems to be a case of the super rich church asking its members, especially leaders to give.
Perhaps it is time to examine the accounts, especially the Extended Minstries report - see how much "accumulted funds" there are in each ministry, especially the ones headed by Jim Guneratnam.
If PG can switch Missions funds to his personal ministry - is it not time to switch accumulated funds - fixed deposits etc from the different ministries to CCC building fund?
Prying questions! Why Not? Is there a personal agenda why there are so much surplus funds in CC yet asking the leaders some of whom have young and colleage children to 'borrow' or worse, some 'retired' members who have limited money for daily needs.
Quote Anon 16.2011 6.06 Pm
'HOW DISGUSTING THIS IS HAPPENING TO CC WITH THE WRONG LEADERSHIP - qualify - WRONG PASTORS AND BOARD OF DEACONS
A TRUE STORY
He graduated from some Bible College and came back with a Pastor bride and she could teach so well. It all looked so promising seeing a godly couple coming to serve together.The testimonies they gave from behind the pulpit was so fantastic.After a few years the cracks began to appear.To make this story short,after a few years he left the church. The last we heard of him was that he was a salesman selling ciggaretes!!! What had happened??And this was the Pastor who at one time preached strongly against alcohol consumption and ciggaretes.(The wife had testified that she had prayed for many years before God led her to this godly man?)
What went wrong??I think we will never know.But many of us think it was the domestic scene. Perhaps her sermons "Wives submit to your husbands"- her interpretation-refers submit only to godly spiritual men.This statement should have given us a hint.
The point I am trying to make is this- too many times we are drawn to preachers who can speak well. Hitler was a great speaker,so was Stalin.But you know what they are capable of doing.
The church is in no better a situation.I have seen this happen again and again with pastors.To me if the Pastor is above the Board- the setup is already bad. They may sound spiritual but are really manipulative. Look at the CC Constitution.Its been there for years but people only noticed it during the CC crisis.SP is a sly devil at work. True, he may have stashed millions away somewhere. They are good at hiding things. Like the Pharisses who talked religious but were in fact lovers of money.
And now the latest is that the cell groups are being asked for $$ again.God bless the brother who said" When you go to church- dont leave your brains outside!!"
I say again brethren- dont feel presurred into giving more money. Give you hard earned money to more worthy causes.TOTT- IT IS WORKING AND WILL WORK!!
This whole thing is becoming more wearisome by the day. Why can't SP just step down and let the deacons pray and appoint another minister? Why? How can one man be so powerful and adamant in the church?Even if all the members were to give up their life savings- THAT WOULD STILL BE NOT ENOUGH. Dont be stupid.Start thinking brethren.This man is hell bent on his CCC project and he will do it even if he has to convert you all into debtors!!!He will never repent and Judgment is already manifesting.A great wonder is about to appear.
A SMALL PIECE FROM A CELL GROUP CONVERSATION
A:HOW IS IT THAT TGG SEEMS TO GET NEWS ABOUT EVERYTHING.
B. I THINK SOME ATTENDING CELL GROUPS ARE TTG.
A.WHAT? WHAT ARE THEY DOING HERE?THEY SHOULD BUZZ OFF!!
B. NOBODY KNOWS.ITS LIKE MALAYSIAN BY ELECTIONS THESE DAYS.SEEMING SUPPORTERS WEAR UMNO T SHIRTS BUT VOTING TIME THEY VOTE FOR PKR.TTG IS LIKE THAT. THEY ARE PHYSICALLY HERE BUT MENTALLY NOT.
A. THEN WHY ARE THEY STILL ATTENDING OUR CELL GROUPS?
B.I DONT KNOW. MAYBE THEY ARE HERE JUST TO PRAY.AFTER ALL ITS ALSO THEIR CHURCH.
A. CHEH!!!!!
By Anonymous
In our view,TGG is very special. They stood up for many of us.They sacrified their time and money . They stood their ground even when the AOG was strangely quiet (NEFC included)on this eposode.May God protect them from religious demons.
...................................
I WHOLLY AGREE WITH THE ABOVE WRITER.PASTORS MAY HATE THIS BLOG BUT THEY SHOULD NOT.ITS TIME FOR HOUSE CLEANSING.MY PASTOR HATES IT TOO." I COULDNT BE BOTHERED BY THAT BLOG" WAS WHAT HE SAID. BUT I THINK HE IS A GIFTED LIAR BECAUSE THIS BLOG DOES BOTHER HIM - THATS WHAT CAUSED HIM TO UTTER THAT STATEMENT.HE ONCE SLYLY PROBED WHETHER I READ THIS BLOG- I IMMEDIATELY LIED AND SAID THAT I DONT.THAT GUY IS SPIRITUALLY DOMINEERING AND I WOULD RATHER STAY OUT OF HIS WAY.WHY DOES HE WANT TO KNOW WHAT OTHERS READ?ITS NONE OF HIS BUSINESS!!YES I DRINK BEER ONCE IN A WHILE BUT I DONT TAKE THE HOLY COMMUNION ON SUNDAYS.BETTER PLAY SAFE THAN BE PUNISHED BY GOD.
JUST A BACHELOR BOY- AND LOVING IT!!!
If CC is unable to pay for the building, who is liable for non payment should the church be sued for non payment?
Posted by Anonymous to Calvary Today at June 17, 2011 12:44 PM
To: Anonymous said...
If CC is unable to pay for the building, who is liable for non payment should the church be sued for non payment?
For the Answer:
Best per person to ask is PG, and the best occasion is
the coming AGM. ( provided he does not stop you!)
The 7 faithful who fought a good fight, have been struck off the VM list, so none of them will be there to question PG & BOD & CCC Commiteee--
let's pray there will be still others who will take up courage to press for TRUTH. ( At all times, they give evasive reply, NO PROPER Report but simply some well prepared statements which are at best VAGUE!
Whatever, they have already gone too far, and the END will be TRAGIC for them & CCC their "pride & Joy'.
Refer to ...If CC is unable to pay for the building, who is liable for non payment should the church be sued for non payment? ...
The BOD is LIABLE fully.
I think the Legal Departments of beneficially BANKs may be looking into it by now ? Is CC a body corporate with a legal entity ?
If the ex-& present Pastors, ex-& present BOD & Elders stood as Guarantors, it is totally a different game altogether! The prudent BAnkers would definitely withdraw the LOANS by now ?
The beneficially Banks will first foreclose the land properties and buildings pledged ! If " TAK CUKUP ", then proceed to recover balance sum from those who stood as guarantors who may need to sell their secular homes to make good their written consent as guarantors !
This whole downfall and their negative consequences are part of the Prophecy foretold.
Did you noticed legally I never address PGs as pastors ? Deuteronomy 8:18-20.
Comment on " A TRUE STORY"
One thing my family can't stand is super spiritual testimonies from other Christians- its usually a fake.In his book " Disappointed with God" the author Philip Yancey writes about a man who testified from the pulpit that he was healed from cancer. A few weeks later Yancey called up the house of the man and the wife picked up the phone. When Yancey enquired about her husband, there was a strange silence,and then she yelled- He's already dead!!!!!
Most of the testimonies we hear in church today are exagerrated or plainly fake.Many are new in the faith.To me the most fantastic testimony is that of Corrie Ten Boom who survived the Nazi camps-God literally brought her through the fire. In her testimony there is hardly any fanfare- just the blunt truth.
All we hear today is victories,blessings and healings and and "meeting the right man".Nothing about the dry periods, the loneliness and the horrible private struggles.
I say there is no point standing up to these pulpit lovers. Pray for discernment and protection whether you are inside the church or outside it.
Me, my family, relatives and friends are following this blog by the day and have learnt so much.God bless your Sunday worship.
Be wary of rogue pastors and leaders.My pastor was a great family counsellor- now he is divorced.We had our letdowns and hopefully we have matured a bit in the process.
NOTE ON BELOW
Refer to ...If CC is unable to pay for the building, who is liable for non payment should the church be sued for non payment??
.................................
You think SP is that stupid so as to allow his own properties to be auctioned off?? We are not dealing with a common mind in the street.Dont listen to what he says- Just look at what he has done and is still capable of doing.So many worshippers had already left.The rest who are still there- hope SP's spell will be broken.
When there are mini scandals in other AOG churches, the Executive was always quick to step in.Today they are sitting idly be- proving that they are toothless.CC crisis is a test case for believers in Malaysia.Many things have surfaced. What is concealed may be even worse.But I think that goes for any churches.
SP singlehandedly has scaterred a worshipping body because of his star trek ship.He should be the first to initiate reconciation- but he does not. I wonder what personal issues he is struggling with that has led to this.He already had his big church,fame, recognition, titles,and money. What else is he after??What does he want?? I get the feeling there is a Judas within the house --plotting the unthinkable!!!
..now and then Judas dipped his hand in the offering bag...
Gospel of John
Today's churches especially AOG churches are turning themselves into a "devil's playground". CC a good example. Jesus predicted this will happened in the end times and in particular, Jesus is pointing His finger at church leaders who will live by humans'instinct and not by the Spirit of God. Its these leaders that the Lord is warning us not to be deceived by them.
Indulging in building mega churches that looked more like a multi-purpose complex, these people who will come coaxing and preaching to the members a sermon of fear that its their duty to give is NEVER THE GOSPEL OF JESUS. Buildings does not glorify God and surely not His vision. The Kingdom of God is within you, not in some building. The vision of God is His desire to see you coming to Him as the "poor in spirit" to worship Him. The Beautitudes Jesus taught in the sermon of the mount in Matthew 5 is God's vision for you.
So to the unsuspecting members who still continue to give, please guard your hearts and do not let yourselves to be deceived by SP, his pastors & BOD. Seek the Lord first and listen to your good consciense that God gave us. We must please God not men.
In the last analysis,I think the church deserves the Pastor it gets.
A believer should pray and do his "quiet time" at home first before lending his ears to another-even the preacher.If a believer is so gullible- thats just too bad- they just got themselves to blame. I have visited CC many times over the years- and I get the feeling that at one time CC was just so proud of their set up and their eloquent SP.In fact they even described themselves as the "fountain head church" despite the fact they hardly supported any church financially.It was in name only- notin fact.
The church reputation has been ruined and its not likely that they will recover.Maybe God has something to say to all of us through these events unfolding before our eyes.
MAGNIFYING GLASS
Hey Brothers and Sisters in Christ, i mentioned this again and again. We should MOVE ON TO THE OTHER CHURCH.
Yes, by having another EGM/AGM, DO NOT MEAN ANYTHING becaused all the church's constitution is written by SP.
SO, HEAD HE WINS, TAIL WE LOSE. Only thing is WALK OUR TALK.
I have been attending other church by now. Even NOTICE THE OFFERING BAGS, IN other church, they DO NOT HAVE THE RING IN THE MIDDLE of the offering bag to BLOCK PEOPLE from taking money out. The CHURCH TRUST THEIR CONGREGRATION. NOT FOR CALVARY. BUT THE SP AND GANG CAN PUT THEIR BIG HANDS INTO THE BAGS TO TAKE THE MONIES OUT FOR THEIR BENEFITS.
SO YOU SEE THE DIFFERENCE???
Fr CT @ June 19, 2011 3:16 PM
NO CHRISTIAN LOVE ON FATHER'S DAY
Today is Sunday June 19, 2011 - which is celbrated internationally as Father's Day, to recognise the importance of fathers as heads of their respective families, to remember their contributions to society and community.
Yet PG chose to spoil the day by his hitting out at (TTG) bloggers in his Father's day message.
What love of Christ is he talking about ? Hypoctite, liar and devil worshipper.
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