At the recently convened Calvary Church EGM on 16 Dec 2011, the Board of Deacons sought the approval of the members to vary the terms of the Calvary Church-Exsim Development Sdn Bhd joint venture on the commercial plot of land adjoining the Calvary Convention Centre (CCC) project.
The variation sought was to allow the title and ownership of the land to be transferred to Exsim upon the receipt of the amount of RM20 million, out of the total agreed purchase price of RM55 million. The variation was approved by the members.
Under the previously approved terms, the title to the land was to be transferred to Exsim only after the receipt of the full sum of RM55 million. However, this situation is not desirable as it would mean that Calvary Church, as land owner, will be a party to every sale and purchase agreement that will be signed in respect of the apartments sold. This, in turn, will result in severe tax implications as highlighted in our previous article on this issue.
(Read Calvary Enters JV with Property Developer dated 22 October 2011.)
One of CT’s readers had sent the article to all the deacons and pastors of Calvary Church, and having taken note of the concerns raised by CT, the Deacons have now come up with the above variation in the terms.
Whether this new revised Agreement will enable the church to avoid Income Tax on the Church’s share of profits from the Development, is too early to tell. Such a risk remains, so does the questions of ethics. Jesus did say that we ought to “give to Caesar what belongs to Caesar” when He was asked if one should pay taxes.
Aside from the issue of tax, the new revised terms, raises a new risk. Previously, the title was to be transferred to Exsim only after the full sum of RM55 million is received. If the Development project is successful, Exsim will have to pay the Church in full in order to secure the title to the land and to enable them to sub-divide and transfer the strata titles to the apartment purchasers.
Now, if the title is transferred to Exsim after they pay only RM20 million, Exsim is no longer under any pressure to pay up the balance RM35 million.
Exsim may have promised to pay the RM35 million in staggered payments over the next 4 years and this may be clearly stated in the agreement but the fact is the church has no collateral or further control over the land. Exsim can very well stretch out the payment over the next 10 years or ask for a discount. In the worse case, the matter may end up in the civil courts for years.
Two Directors of Exsim have agreed to guarantee the RM35 million balance amount but however, their personal net worth is unknown and therefore, it is difficult to ascertain if their guarantee is worth the outstanding debt. Besides, enforcement of guarantees can only be commenced after ALL ATTEMPTS of recovery from Exsim have been executed.
This is the most obvious sign that Pastor Prince Guneratnam (PG) has become so desperate to get his CCC built that basic common sense and rationale no longer prevailed.
PG’s desperation bodes well for Exsim.
Why was Exsim selected to be so “blessed” by Calvary Church remains a big question mark?
Who is Exsim?
Actually, very little is known about this joint venture partner of Calvary Church. As reported in our earlier article, Exsim Group is a small, industrial and commercial lot developer, which recently undertook a residential condo development called the “The Treez” in Bukit Jalil.
From the Exsim website and “The Treez: brochure, the “the Treez” project was developed by Jalilmax Development Sdn Bhd,.
A search at the Companies Commission revealed that Jalilmax was incorporated on 8-8-2005. The directors of Jalilmax are Lim Aik Hoe, Lim Tau Fong and Lim Aik Kiat. Exsim Development Sdn Bhd is listed as the current owners of Jalilmax.
On the other hand, Exsim Development Sdn Bhd was incorporated only on 14-10-2009 with a paid-up capital of only RM100,000. Its directors are Chong Peck Ee, Loo Yoke Foong, Puang Wan Ching and Wong Siong Lin.
The directors of Exsim and Jalilmax are totally different people. Perhaps, the information
available from the Companies Commission has not been updated but the fact remains that Jalilmax was set up earlier and taken over by Exsim only after 14-10-2009.
With only a paid-up capital of RM100,000, Exsim does not even qualify to apply for a Developer’s Licence. The law requires a Developer to have a minimum paid-up capital of RM250,000 before they can be issued a licence to commence any property development.
It is quite likely that Exsim will incorporate a new subsidiary company to undertake the development of Calvary’s commercial land as is normally the case with property development groups where the holding company remains purely an investment holding company while the subsidiaries are the actual developers. This is to protect the holding company from legal liabilities should any development goes sour or gets entangled legally or financially.
The gross development value (GDV) of Exsim Group’s total projects are a mere fraction compared to the GDV of the big players like Sunway, Glomac, Sime Darby, MK Land, SP Setia, and Sunrise whose GDVs run into tens of billions of ringgit.
So is PG taking a “gamble” with a small company like Exsim? He certainly is!
With the 2013 Pentescostal World Conference in Kuala Lumpur looming near, PG is desperate. He had already announced to the world that he is hosting the conference in CCC and so, it will be a huge loss of face for him, if the CCC is not completed in time.
189 comments:
Calvary Church through CCC is slowly and surely slipping into HEAVY DEBT in due course!
" The variation sought was to allow the title and ownership of the land to be transferred to Exsim upon the receipt of the amount of RM20 million, out of the total agreed purchase price of RM55 million.The variation was approved by the members. "
This is A BAD OMEN for CCC & CC ! Now I understand why my DREAM was meant to be !
Ray Stedman once reminded us that the Temple or House of God is the body of believers and not a building or any fancy super structure no matter how magnificient the structure is. The building is merely the place where the real House of God (the believers) gathers to worship in.
But once the Pastors and leaders become swollen headed and pride fills their hearts, they begin to loose focus on the people which is the true House of God and begin to focus on building their dream grandiose building they call "church". It's the start of name and empire building. It's chasing after personal desires, dreams and ambitions they call vision. When it seeks to be ahead of others and impress the world, it's nothing more than building another crystal cathedral. God does not require a fancy building to reside in but desires to reside in the true temple and house where He is Lord and God.
God have mercy on CC.
Let's hope that the latest arrangement with the Developer is not a grand design by the evil PG to defraud CC of its property while enriching himself by dubious means.
In the event the developer wounds up after completing the project but before paying the remaining of the RM55m, I wonder how the land would be recovered from the company/liquidators.
I can smell a lot of things very fishy here!
Hope that the prophecy here does not materialise.
STUPID MOVE ? LOUSY DEAL ?
Wow ! IF the information available is reliable and correct... imagine having the title and ownership of the land to be transferred to your company upon receipt of ONLY RM20 million, NOT THE FULL AGREED PURCHASE PRICE OF RM55 MILLION ! Reason allegedly behind this move ... are to avoid certain taxes and avoid certain administrative procedures. isn't this "strategy" seemed contrary to normal market practice of receiving full and final payment before any land title and ownership name transfer is even allowed ?
How come the chairman and board of directors, representing the best interest of cc and ccc, were caught in such apparently sticky situation ? How come they were not earlier adequately and properly advised of such possible mess by by the church's lawyers and/or legal advisors ?
Question on our minds, would the "variation" deemed being unfavourably worded against the best interests of cc and ccc ?
Any comments from fellow bloggers esp lawyers and legal advisors on this issue ? any suggestions ? any better alternatives ?
What are the implications of such a "variation move" ? Would the developer not still feel the pressure to make the balance payments promptly and regularly (once the land title and ownership is effected) ?
Another mess in the making, no thanks to "you know who" type of rogue leadership !
What a way to start our NEW YEAR 2012 ! The gigantic fireworks are already set up to blast cc, dragging all concerned into poverty, even bankruptcy and even infamy !
And the rogue leader yesterday said that cc did not need to borrow a single sen from the banks. His version seemed totally off the target. We heard and we read that ALL THE BANKS DO NOT WANT TO LOAN US THE MONEY ! Would you care to explain why the banks refused us the loans, rogue leader ?
They have passed the point of no return. Whichever decision they make now will not stop CC from serious bleeding financially and with long term consequences. Bigger structures don't mean it's a bigger and more effective lighthouse. Whatever happened to prayer for Godly wisdom ? Or is their prayer the name it and claim it type and God is only asked to endorse their plans and strategies. Has our will and desires now surmounted God's will ?
We are into the 4th day of the New Year 2012.According to the prophecies of Nostradamus this is the final year where the Universe melts down the elements.Of course Christians take their guidance from God's Word which is written by Gods Spirit-not Mr. Nostradamus.
Of course we can understand why AOG Pastors do not preach the end times anymore.It is hardly preached and is usually watered down.The reason is obvious- if the second coming is imminent, then why put up mega buldings? This is one area the carnal preacher will never change.
I urge more born again believers to contribute to this blog about their own experience with the AOG leaderships.This is the only way to create awareness in the greater body of Christ.
Some Pastors are tyrants over their stale flock.They would be unhappy if any of their sheep visit other churches EVEN if it has benefited the sheep.To them its all about control- and some are selfish and domineering.
SP's misdeeds have been exposed and together with it -the whole AOG system which is sitting idly by.
Let this year be a year of growth for all Christians.If any of you have been abused by the AOG leadership-write and share your experiences.other Christians can be aware of the pitfalls.
I used to attend an AOG church where if a member does not pay his tithes-their names would be put up on the Notice Board.This is another example of AOG bullshit.Memebers would eventually pay-out of embarassment.Pastors like this need to be voted out but the members cant-because the power is focused in them.
With the CC crisis- I believe a new day has arrived. And if you see any AOG Pastor throwing his weight around- move away from him.Dont be impressed by his Bible knowledge or his preaching OR hi babbling in tongues.
God bless you all & God Bless all the Pastors who labour in His Vineyards!!!May the Grace & Peace of Jesus be with you throughout this year.
"My Peace I leave with you." John 14.
Christian Quote for Thought:
" A church debt is the devil's salary."
Henry Ward Beecher
With the CC crisis- I believe a new day has arrived. And if you see any AOG Pastor throwing his weight around- move away from him.Dont be impressed by his Bible knowledge or his preaching OR hi babbling in tongues.
............................
A big thank you for the above advise. I agree that there is no point locking horns with these so called Reverends.It is much safer to just move away and start over some place else. Bless our New Year.
TRANSPARENCY THE PUBLIC'S NORM
For those who missed the news article, please read : Sunday Star 11 December, 2011 headlined "Charity Inc." which stated : "Charities and welfare organisations are transforming their business model as they compete for the last dime in public donations."
"Gone were the days of soliciting one off street contributions as charities are forced to adopt corporate practices to persuade s sustainable pool of donors to support their cause."
It further elaborated very interestingly relevant ot our ccc issue :
"Besides having to be MORE TRANSPARENT ABOUT THEIR WORK, charities are increasingly turning to social networking road shows and partnerships with other organisations get funds."
"This comes as donors have become MORE INSISTENT ABOUT KNOWING WHERE THEIR MONEY IS GOING, especially given the hard times."
CHARITIES HURT AS MALAYSIANS ARE HIT IN THE POCKET
"charities are bracing for a drop in donations from corporations with the latter expected to adopt COST CUTTING MEASURES DUE TO ECONOMIC UNCERTAINTIES AHEAD."
Note: the capital letters are our, not Star Sunday's, bring emphasis of certain words in their article for CT readers' attention.
If you read between the lines on the various local news articles - for example, domestic violence, wife abuse, child abuse, increasing divorce rates, increasing unemployment, rising bankruptcy cases - all these are indicators of the BAD economic and socioeconomic TIMES AHEAD ahead.
No wonder, all the sermons in cc sound and look like business modules conducted by hard core true blue of multi level marketing speakers (A-way, B-way, C-way, etc - you get the drift) !
The news article warns us of doom and gloom ahead ...
AND YET, the rogue priest and his gang continues to try painting a rosy picture of the speedy progress of construction of ccc !!!! .... "without cc owing a sen to the banks" !!!!! And they continue enjoying fat salaries, extra perks, hidden benefits, etc within the comfort zone they created for their ownselves and families - allegedly and suspectedly at the expense of the church well being and interest.
Alot of unanswered questions are trapped within the totalitarian regime of this dictator in priest clothes, deceiving too many int eh flock with his "outwardly gentle smiling, even charming" mannerisms, smoke screening his evil diabolical craftiness and hard heartedness of a conman, crook, hypocrite and a money sucking parasite.
Are the bungalows around the main D. E. church already charged to banks or even being sold ? Why did the food section shift from the CRC bungalow one day ?
Stop believing this Satan's henchman destroying our cc from within the church !!!!
TTOTT !!!!!
Totally Turn Off the Tap !!!!!!!
The construction of ccc was and is NOT with God's blessings and anointing. Just refer to the background of sins committed by this satanic priest and his henchmen ass. pastors, deacons, church staff, etc.
Therefore, TOTT !!!!!
To quote the satanic priest, "Haiya, why are you so quiet ? Say an amen lah !"
Have a nice day, buddy ! (And pray hard for God t o confound the evil plans of this satanic priest to plunge our congregations into fathomless debts - for generations to come .... ! Is this what special guest speaker during ccc corner stone ceremony meant about passing on something to our future generations ?
God help us to continue spreading the truth to all others. may mopre become ware of the lies from this regime, and not fall into their traps.
Amen.
Pure Nonsense from Nostradamus
We believe that we should put our faith and trust totally in God and His Lovingkindness for all of us. However, in the past, before we were born again Christians, we too committed the sin of "chasing after the wind", believing in "answers to life's riddles" coming from false prophets like Nostradamus, who purportedly could predict the future, even hundreds of years before his time.
Firstly, the truth of the matter is that Nostradamus - the poor man COULD NOT even predict the year he would die, much less the exact hour, minutes and seconds.
Secondly, all conclusions drawn from Nostradamus's writings come AFTER, NOT BEFORE, the happenings. For example, the rise and fall of the dictator Hitler - which his supporters claimed he misnamed "Hisler". Close enough ? Not true.
Like Nostradamus, there are many false prophets in the church, deceiving easily the very elect. Whatever happened to the once popular "prophet" Bernard Blessings. The church leaders are too embarassed to talk about him. The truth is that even Church pastors and leaders are easily deceived, lacking in Godly wisdom and discernment and often blinded by personal agenda and grand ambition.
We are so obsessed in signs and wonders and mystical experiences and excitement that we often fail to discern. And so together with the pastors and leaders, many fall into the path of deception, no different from the falsehood of Nostradamus.
What actually happened to Bernard Blessing? He used to visit my church (an AOG church) at least once a year for healing encounter rallies. But he was not invited to preach last year. Church leaders said it is good to get a different speaker for a change. But i don't believe it. Any answers?
I heard Bernard preach past year at a certain church.In my opinion most of the healings and prophecies are fake.He is extremely Charismatic and shows a carrot--homegrown in the Pentecostal backyard... before the excited Horse- healings, prosperity and what nots. There are many fantastic promises in the Holy Bible but none of them will work if it is not preceded by the one word- "obedience" to the promptings of the Spirit within.
I have talked to the people that he prophesied over-the same conditions & depression are over them.No change.
So what is the answer?I think Christians should move on towards maturity.I have heard it preached oftentimes that Jesus always heals.Does He, Sir?
In John 5- Jesus only healed one man and quickly moved away.Time to reflect.
God bless all and remember- God is no ones Butler.He never was in that business-so it behooves the Christian to wake up to avoid disappointments.
God Bless You all-A Church Wandering spirit on Planet Earth.
Dale Lim, the son of PG's bosom pal, Robert Lim, is the senior pastor of Evangel Family Church in Singapore.
Dale is a professional with a degree in computer science and was working in the secular world before he joined his father's church when Marion Lim was the senior pastor.
PG must be green with envy when Robert's son joined EFC.
Calvarites, beware! PG would do everything in his power including unethical means to get Jim to have total control of CC. This threat is real. PG's action concerning Jim shows. PG has appointed Jim the Administrative Executive of CC, the Director of the communication ministry, the Director of the bookshop, Jim who knows next to nothing about the construction industry is the Project executive of CCC and in Calvary News issue 133, Jim is sitting next to PG2. All this indicates PG and PG2 grooming Jim to take control of CC in the future! For a start, Jim will probably be appointed with some grand sounding title to take charge of CCC when it is fit for occupation.
To Anonymous Jan. 7, 1:40am., Bernard Blessing has been exposed as a liar in many of his claims. Read about his lies and false claims at:
www.ccgm.org.au/index.php?g=articles&a=0139
Some of the points from the above article:
Blessing, from Ghana, is a consummate religious actor and con-artist.
He has gone from just plain Bernard Blessing to 'Reverend' to 'Prophet' to 'Doctor'.
Extreme poverty drove his mother into prostitution - lies; she came from a very respectable and well-off family.
He had no schooling and learnt to read by watching other boys - lies; he had a good education completing secondary school.
He converted his prostitute and uneducated mother to Christianity - lies; his mother came from a a very Christian family and had been well educated.
Any many more lies in the above article.
To read about Bernard Blessings go to www.lookout.org.au and click on articles.
Even Pastors in some AOG churches in KL got deceived by BB, having invited him not once but numerous times to speak in their churches. They once used to speak praises of BB. But now they avoid telling their congregation the truth so as not to show their gullibility and lack of Godly wisdom and discernment, having been directly responsible in leading their members to partake in deception. Yet they won't apologise to members for the grave and serious error they made but instead try to hide the truth and make excuses to explain why BB has not been invited to speak again. They must look good and wise before the members. Such is their face saving attempt but they forgot that these are the days of the internet and they cannot hide the truth forever. So much for the humility and transparency in pastors and even more reason for us to judge, evaluate and discern what they say as the bible exhort us to.
I don't understand one thing: if the developer will own the land with only RM55mil, the CCC will be on a leasehold land?
It seem like everything are done only for present want, that is to build CCC, but no one think about the future.
Maybe PG just want to build CCC to gain face and then cabut as so called international evangelise, but CC will be bound by huge debt. HOw can the members approve it?
CHRISTIANS LABOURING IN A VINEYARD NOT AUTHORISED BY GOD!
The Lord GOD has sworn by Himself, the LORD God of hosts says: “I abhor the pride of JACOB (aka Rogue Christian Leaders) and hate his PALACES (aka Monuments they build); therefore I will deliver up the CITY and ALL that is in it (Misguided Christians who continue to support Rogue Leaders).” (Amos 6:8).
When God delays punishment, it does not mean He approves of a person's thoughts and deeds. If a person refuses to repent, he will eventually reap the consequences. "Do not be deceived, God is not mocked; for whatever a man sows, that he will also reap" (Galatians 6:7, NKJV). "A man who remains stiff-necked after many rebukes will suddenly be destroyed--without remedy" (Proverbs 29:1, NASB).
Our New Year resolution should be ‘hands off’ and ‘stop helping God’ and watch the Lord fight our Battles and WIN THE WAR! I appreciate this truth more now as I witness a series of events where the Lord is dealing with my enemies and bringing them under His foot! Every weapon that is formed against the Children of God shall not prosper. Hold on this TRUTH! It may take years, BUT GOD KEEPS HIS PROMISE!
We have a mistaken belief when we think that God needs our help. He does not. He rules according to the counsel of His own will. However, He does invite us as co-workers in His works and in such labour, God and we will always prevail. However, many do not recognise that the invitation is according to the sovereign will of God. Although David so much wanted to build the Temple, but the Lord said Solomon shall build it. We need to ask, “Did the Lord really anoint the building of the Temple of Calvary Church?”. Even if He did, who did He anoint to build it……the present leader or His chosen leader that has yet to be revealed!
We need to discern when we are invited to be co-workers and when we are just to be spectators. Knowing this Truth will save many from wasted labour and heartbreaks. Unless the LORD builds the house, they labour in vain that build it: unless the LORD keeps the city, the watchman wakes, but in vain (Psalm 127).
Let me give you a real example. There was a bright Christian in a church I know. He was offered a scholarship to study for a University Degree but his pastor felt he should serve him in his church and together build a Mega Church. I felt he would be more useful to the Lord working in the “secular world” (Note there is no such distinction in the Bible – the separation of secular and church work is the work of misguided Christians. Both are equal forms of worship to the Lord)
Because of continued pressure from the Pastor, he eventually went to Bible College and obtained a degree in Theology. He started building a Mega Church for the Lord but ……it never became a reality. Today he is still struggling in his ministry. He now regrets listening to his pastor and not the still small voice. This is a case of a Christian Leader who is an uninvited worker labouring in an unauthorised vineyard.
We are each called for a specific task and we should not support any Christian Leader who causes us to labour and build Palaces that are not anointed by the Lord. We will one day regret it ... just like my brother above.
I am deeply concerned that the majority of the members of Calvary Church have approved the variation order. I see a parallel in the rebellion of the Children of Israel who supported evil leaders who wanted to kill Moses and the other prophets. Old Testament history is being replayed in Modern times. And….the Lord will use this as an example and a warning to others in His time. This is a classic case of misguided Christians labouring in an unauthorised vineyard. They will one day regret their action just as my brother did. Mark my word…..they will one day regret their decision. God is not mocked. We reap what we sow. BUT there is a way out … repent and don’t support such rogue leaders. Stand for TRUTH.
Blessed 2012…….May this be the Kairos Year of the Lord for His Truth to prevail
Vijay
I don't understand one thing: if the developer will own the land with only RM55mil, the CCC will be on a leasehold land?
It seem like everything are done only for present want, that is to build CCC, but no one think about the future.
Maybe PG just want to build CCC to gain face and then cabut as so called international evangelise, but CC will be bound by huge debt. HOw can the members approve it?
To Anonymous:
You're confused by the land title. There are 2 pieces of land and thus 2 land titles.One is where the CCC is being built on. The other--a smaller and narrower strip of land--is the one that is the deal with Exsim. So the CCC land won't be affected. Hope this clears things up for you.
Someone sent me this joke - I think it originates from India. But it applies to us too just as well - especially CC!
SURPRISING OUTCOMES OF THE EDUCATION SYSTEM !
The smartest high school students with many distinctions get admissions to medical, engineering, architect and science schools. They become doctors, engineers, architects, scientists who cure people and build things for society.
The students with less distinctions end up getting get MBA's and LLB's to manage (or harass) the doctors, engineers and others. .
Those mediocre students with no distinctions or just one or two distinctions enter politics, and cause chaos for both categories above.
Those students who are borderline cases join the underworld and eventually control all the others especially the politicians and the businesses.
And best of all?
Those students who are the duds, the school drop outs or who did not attend any modern school system (secular or scientific education) they become the priests, the religious people, swamis, gurus, tok guru and tok imam.
This group can threaten all the other people mentioned above (yours truly exempted) with heaven or hell. They control everyone's mind.
Whether you are a doctor, engineer, lawyer, scientist, architect, accountant or whatever, whether you are a Hindu, Muslim, Buddhist or whatever when you go to your temple on Monday, to the mosque on Friday or church on Sunday - you place yourself at the mercy of this last category of people.
Forget your PhDs, forget your MBBS, your LLB, MBA, your four years of university education. You surrender yourself to people whom you may not even have noticed when you were both in high school.
PLim
Posted by Anonymous to Calvary Today at January 9, 2012 8:13 AM
PG and the APs asking the congregation to give a sacrificial gift and the Deacons asked for a generous offering for CC's pastors.
It's now 2012 and another Faith Promise renewal. CC is always asking for more but has PG and the AP's themselves made a sacrificial gift. It was so distressing to make a collection for the pastors for Christmas. The pastors will have all the reasons in the world to accept the offering but will not walk the talk on sacrificial offering.
The Faith promise collection for July to December 2011 is a miserable RM1.57 mil against a pledge of RM2.81 mil. So what had been collected is only 61.4% of what had been pledged. It clearly sends a signal to the church that givers today are more discerning and are not taken in by the sweet talk coupled with the uncertain economic outlook and TOTT, it will be a rough road for CC.
The church I am now attending did not ask for a Christmas gift for the pastors. Neither did it make a big deal about the senior pastor's birthday. No announcement, nothing. The senior pastor only mentioned it after the event to tell how old he was. CC must get away from senior pastor worship. It is idolatry.
BEWARE OF "POKE EYE" TRANSGRESSIONS
BY ROGUE LEADER
Question : How come Apa*Guna*Ratman PeeGee* (as Project Chairman) and his son JG (as Project Director) alone were exclusively involved in the direct negotiations
over CCC Joint Venture with this relatively unknown insignificant Ex******* group "developer" ?
Why did it happen without the BOD having any representation ? Why did the BOD failed in their duties to protect interests of the church ? Why did the BOD commit such gross omissions to prevent the rogue priest being too powerful ? BOD are answerable for your actions to us all and to God.
BTW the recent EGM is all a sham, orchestrated to show rogue priest's "democracy" by planting his "members" voting favouring the motions. With the 400 plus members already axed, and having right to vote, plus so many have left cc, means no opposition at all. Among the remainder, too many boycotted the EGM since their freedom to speak is banned.
We now conclude the rogue priest purposely misled the members to believe the selected JV partner was an excellent choice among three candidates, two among them automatically knocked out by the assigned committee.) It was practically a Hobson's choice, no choice situation. ALL three should be rejected!
O God hear our outcry of pain and sorrow ! Our church is already paying very heavily for terrible mistake of the rogue leader's poor business acumen and stupid management decision, signing contract with such an unsuitable JV partner, for CCC project, costing estimated RM 350 million.
The invited Indian preacher Ivan said we would be world famous - for all the WRONG REASONS, pointing fingers and laughing at our failed CCC Project, as a costly lesson to others.
Now the truth comes out. PweeGee was dealing with NOT a full fledged well established developer ! CT found out that being incorporated in 2009 with a paid up capital of RM 100,000.00, "it DOES NOT qualify to apply for a Developer's License" !
The satanic priest is ignoring Godly wisdom, siding the devil, to achieve fame and fortune, by trying to complete the prestigious CCC mega project on time. He is "sacrificing" our precious hard earned money, NOT caring a bit about loses!
We all know about the latest mess developed over the variation option allowing the partner to transfer the title to their name after paying only RM 20 million out of the total agreed purchase price of RM 55 million - is the church's interests being unfairly represented in the "variation option" ?
Why would the rogue leader consent to such a lopsided agreement ?
Who empowered him to make such decision ? Who are paying all the money for the CCC project ? The PeeGee and family or we suckers ?
Do not still allow such nonsense in our church. This rogue leader is making very costly mistakes that would ruin not only our church, but also the member's finances, bringing us and our future generations of c-rites into huge bad debts.
Totally turn Off The Tap ! TTOTT !
Totally turn Off The Tap ! TTOTT !
Stop this mad man from dragging us all into bankruptcies ! NOW !
Once again, all these issues and problems confirm that the building of CCC does not come from God, but from a mad man's extremely selfish dreams of power and fame.
Christian Quote for Thought:
" I do not think the devil cares how many churches you
build, if only you have lukewarm preachers and people in them."
Charles Spurgeon
Bernard Blessing was in CC in 2005 and 2006. He was in another well-known church in PJ in 2007, 2008, 2009 and 2010.
He has spewed so many lies and yet he was in Malaysia so many times. Does this not show that pastors all over are so gullible! This is an example of "swallowing hook, line and sinker' by the reverends, doctors (theology) who hold the notion that religious celebrities do no wrong. With the internet today, information comes with a click - to quote Ps SK: there is so much information on wikipedia on so many things.
It is difficult to believe that the pastors are not aware or ignorant of the controversies/scandals that surround many renown reverend pastors. Rather they choose not to be believe it - their reply to these information is: do not believe everything that is on the internet. This is because it will reflect on their gullibility and their condonation of such behaviours among pastors. Or maybe they think that they are above all man.
A good example is PG and his pastors in CC. Even though there is so much information available, PG and his pastors had given so much accolades and praises to Richard Roberts and David Yonggi Cho in 2011. Anyway, PG himself is mired in numerous controversies! Birds of the same feather flock together.
HELLBOUND TOWARDS SELF DESTRUCTION
PeeGee's pet project, ccc, seemed to face neverending series of troubles. Actually we all should not be surprised at all by such problems since the mega project was never approved by God. Especially not when the structure was designed by a self confessed member of the Freemason cult, who allegedly incorporated certain Freemason symbols like the serpent (representing Satan) and the Pharaoh's Tomb (represnting occult or magical powers).Most certainly we do not believe PeeGee was/is an annointed pastor but a satanic priest.
Further, our congregation certainly does not need such a mega complex to be built all at once, to meet the deadline for the 2013 World Convention.
All we require is a decent looking basic church structure with capacity to house five thousand or less, thereby reducing the total costs to a fraction of the ever growing inflated figures. Especially since cc experience mass emigration elsewhere to other churches. (Not surprising about the shrinking numbers in the congregation since our sermons always centred on money, money and money, besides sacrificial giving, love offerings, faith promises, pledges, etc.)
Based on all probabilities, our church appears doomed to move in only one direction- DOWNWARDS into self destruction undeer the hellbound leadership of this satanic priest.
god help us.
FAITH PROMISE SUNDAY
Ha Ha Ha Ha ! You all should see the shock on PeeGee's face when all the faith promise cards were collected and handed over by the ushers, walking up and down the aisles. Judging from the thin pile of faith promises cards collected, we observed firstly church attendance was especially low. secondly, we suspect so many did not bother to return the faith promise cards. very wise decision to totally turn off the tap (TTOTT).
TTOTT is working like grease work !
Praise The Lord (PTL) !
Let's ask PeeGee and his cohorts to give sacrificially first ! Why don't they sell off their fancy expensive cars and donate every single sen to ccc funds ? why don't they sell off their expensive houses including bungalows and donate their money to ccc funds ? Why don't they downsize the church staff force to save money ? why don't they take serious pay cuts eg fifty or even seventy five percent less from their fat salaries ?
Why don't they wear t-shirta and jeans instead of classy business suits and shiny leather shoes ? Why don't they skip their expensive fine dining and donate the money to the church ?
Why don;t they say God spoke to all of them to do just that - all the above ? sacrificial giving by these crooks, conmen, hypocrites, parasites, thieves, gangsters, wolves ? Fat hopes.... no way, man.
They never heard of Dr M's "Leadership by example" !
They know "What is yours is mine, what is mine is MINE !"
And they got ways to get the money off our pockets and wallets, purses, etc.
SATANIC CULT LEADERS AND CHARLATAN HEALERS SIGNIFY END TIMES
The alarming proliferation of false prophets, satanic cult leaders and charlatan healers - just to name a few - holding senior positions in churches as the chief opinion leaders of the congregation, while craftily leading them astray, signifies the coming of the end times.
The warnings in the Holy Bible about them are numerous :
"If anyone teaches otherwise and does not consent to wholesome words, even the words of our Lord Jesus Christ, and to the doctrine which accords with godliness, he is proud, knowing nothing, but is obsessed with disputes and argument over words from which come envy, strife, reviling evil suspicions, useless wranglings, of men of corrupt minds and destitute of the truth, who suppose that godliness is a means of gain. From such withdraw yourself.
(1 Timothy 6:3-5)
Peter calls false teachers "wells without water" and Jude says they are "clouds without water".
"These are wells without water, clouds carried by a tempest for whom is received the blackness of darkness forever."
(2 Peter 2:17).
Equally revealing is the following verse :
"For the time has come for judgement to begin at the house of God, and if it begins with us first, what will be the end of those who do not obey the gospel of God ? Now "If the righteous one is scarcely saved, where will the ungodly and sinner appear ?"
(1 Peter 4:17-18.)
Last but not least,. we are warned that : The thief does not come except to steal, and to kill, and to destroy." (John 10:10a).
May God open our spiritual eyes to see that the thieves are already here inside our churches, having infiltrated the upper echelons of the churches, , in the forms of false prophets, satanic teachers, charlatan healers, and all others in the hierarchy of Lucifer and his demons.
We have various reasons to suspect that PeeGee is one such false prophet, drawing our church to its spiritual, physical, psychological, financial, emotional doom. !
The plan to build CCC comes from the Devil, not God. Be warned of this evil person. He is NOT, most definitely NOT, an annointed messenger from God.
Anonymous Jan 12,2012 11:21PM
It means all the more for members in CC to be more discerning and not swallow everything the pastors say. Making such a serious mistake by inviting Bernard Blessings not once but twice to speak in CC shows an acute lack of discernment and Godly wisdom on part of the pastors. If no apologies were made to members for the grave error, it just goes to show another serious lack in the leadership, and that is humility.
Heed the Bible's warnings on false prophets and wolves in sheep's clothings. Flee from the word of faith teachings and the prosperity gospel of silver and gold, peddled by fame, glory and fortune seekers.
A COMMENT ON
It means all the more for members in CC to be more discerning and not swallow everything the pastors say.."
...................................
It is just so true.I think gone are the days when members swallowed everything the man in the pulpit uttered-because he happend to have a Rev.title.Mine was a pathetic example.He definitely has hidden issues with other members and AOG ministers.I could not believe my ears when I first heard him myself slyly run down one of his former Pastor friends.He looks innocent but there is definitely something lurking beneath that religious face.My wife felt very uncomfortable when he mentioned in a cell group at supper that so and so has a drinking problem. Anyway- what is that to him?? It is certainly easy hiding in an air conditioned church and running down others for smoking,drinking and what nots!!!! Wake up-lah Mr. Rev.Pastor!!You are not preaching to Angels- only to vessels of clay.We prayed and moved on.This cell group was nothing but a place of gossip and to boast about each others oversea trips.
Moreover we noticed that AOG pastors are very clickish. They have their own friends whom they invite- presumably hoping to be invited in return. They operate within their own circle of Rev.friends.
This is one of the diseases that runs through the AOG system- and one which they will never admit!The bloggers here have done a great thing in the sense that it has brought in awareness to the greater body of Chirst.
Can you imagine the sermon title in our Youth Camp- Blogging is a Sin!!! When the AOG Rev. Railed and Ranted against drinking beer- a youth asked " What about Root Beer?" And the Rev"s answer was- You cant either because the word "Beer" is there!!! Bad Christian testimony and he threw out a Bible verse- " Abstain from all appearances of evil"
We dont know where this joker graduated from but we certainly had to move away our College kids from this AOG Rev and his Holy Living Crap!!! It was just so stressful listening to his AOG bullshit week after week.
Have a Blessed Chinese New Year.
TOGETHER LETS SAY "NO" TO AOG CHURCH BULLSHIT AND GET BACK TO BIBLE STUDY.
HE SAID WHAT??
...............................
- a youth asked " What about Root Beer?" And the Rev"s answer was- You cant either because the word "Beer" is there!!! Bad Christian testimony and he threw out a Bible verse- " Abstain from all appearances of evil"
..................................
HAHAHAHAHAHAH!!!!! IN OUR CHURCH LIFE THE WHOLE CHURCH ATTENTION WAS NOT CENTERED ON CHRIST OR GOD BUT THE AOG REV.PASTOR. HE JUST LOVED TO BE ADORED AND HE HAS THE FINAL SAY IN ALL CHURCH MATTERS AND MORAL ISSUES.IF YOU ASK ME-HE IS ONE LOST MAN THINKING THAT GOD HAS CALLED HIM TO REPRESENT HIM. MAYBE HE SHOULD GO TO THE "STATION OF LIFE" TO GET SOME REALITY CHECK.I HEARD THE LADY THERE IS VERY GOOD AT DEMOLISHING RELIGIOUS DELUSIONS & SELF DECEPTIONS THAT TENDS TO CREEP ON PEOPLE WHO HAVE BEEN TITLED WITH A DISTINGUISHED TITLE BY THE SYSTEM.
ITS DANGEROUS TO HAVE PEOPLE LIKE HIM TO HAVE ACCESS TO YOUR FAMILY MEMBERS.WHAT A JOKER!!MAYBE SOMEONE NEEDS TO TELL HIM THE TRUTH - THAT HE CAN APPLY FOR A JOB AS A STAND UP JOKER FOR SOME TV.COMEDY!!!HE SHOULD NOT BE IN THE CHURCH TALKING OT THE YOUTH AT ALL.
GOD BLESS YOU ALL.
"BEWARE OF THE DOGS"
(Phillippians)
Beware of Dogs , beware of evil workers, beware of the circumcision. Philippians 3:2[ Apostle Paul]
..................................
It is really regretabble to read this- much less to comment on it- but the church at Philippi had to be cautioned.Religious dogs operating within the church is nothing new- it has all happened before.In those days dogs were not domesticated but were running around the dung heaps with snarling teeth- subduing others with their presence.Visitors to India would have seen this.jUST ONE SNARL -AND YOU HAD TO BACK OFF!
But Scriptures are straightfoward in their warnings to the church about these religious breed.And sometimes we need to put a signboard outside the church "Beware of Dogs Preaching" Of course it was referring to the church leaders of that day who would not submit to anyone and saw themselves as the Gods elect.
The circumcision were approved by their denomination so they came around with their titles and began to throw their weight around inside the church.It takes a humble man like Paul to warn the Christian inside church about this people- and RIGHTLY HE HAS DESCRIBED THEM AS DOGS!!!!
have a great weekend and God bless all the worshippers.--
REASONS BEHIND "NO" TO BLOGGING
VERY URGENT
Overwhelmingly too many self serving pastors and religious church leaders feel threatened (scared to death) by the super easy availability of worldwide blogging.
Why, you may ask ? Why so afraid ?
Simply because ...
They are absolutely powerless control or ban free flow of information, especially glaring truths concerning, for example, :
1. their sins committed, past and present,
2. comments about their weaknesses and excesses,
3. their secret personal lives, esp love lives, and extra martital affairs,
4. their hidden carnal natures, eg including streaking (garment malfunction ?) at the public pool, and subsequent sacking from the private club,
5. their harsh mistreatment of others,
6. their unauthorised transfers of church funds,
7. their abuse of power within and outside the churches,
8. their actual excessively paid stipends (salaries), unknown to and kept secret from their congregations,
9. their secret bonuses, allowances, perks, and benefits - kept hidden from public knowledge,
10. the secret church sponsorships of their children's and grand children's overseas education
11. their secret about life memberships in eg celebrity fitness / health clubs aka gyms, with service by personal trainers, fully paid for by their churches,
12. their super high class shopping life styles, including exclusive personal viewings at jewellery shops, and
13. their creation of sinicures, creation of high sounding posts and positions within their churches for their children and son in laws like Directors of this and Directors of that posts.
14. their unashamed practice of cronyism and nepotism,
15. and their other unbelievable unmentionable transgressions.
Naturally, they are scared like shit to have their terrible sins circulatingd internationally, so freely across borders, to millions of bloggers.
.jUST ONE SNARL -AND YOU HAD TO BACK OFF!
..................................
Yes, I as a young person have seen this demonstrated by my Previous pastor- how he shouted at another Pastor friend in full view of the others.It was uncalled for.What was bothersome was this- after that "show of authority and power" he showed no sign of remorse for his demonic actions- instead he was gloating from ear to ear- that he had shouted down another person.Most probably another demon possessed AOG Rev.(There are many out there right now under various guises.
Some of here have reason to believe that he is already backslidden until today.Others believe that it was plain envy that the other Pastor was more welcome in many other churches. One suspects that he has a secret crush on one of the church youth and tends to act "macho" in her presence.What a stupid mentality for a pastor to have.He should be spending more time with his wife then trying to impress the youth with his "protective"crap/
Whatever it was- his manner and demeanor certainly was not from a shepherding heart but from a fowl spirit on him. I believe that it was the same spirit on SP when he shouted down at Liza and that Salesman RY(a high salaried religious devil operating within a church) escorted her out of the church.
It is indeed shameful when church leaders behave like this.Hurting and wounding others and they could not be bothered at all.But what is to worry? End of the month they collect their salaries and just sit around for another month to pass by. These are those who serve for filthy lucre.And the church can have their religious circus going on.
They have become so important in church that they believe without them around the whole church would collapse.Most Malaysian politicians have this mindset.
A big thank you to all contributors to this blog.Someone has written that the pastors are frustrated because this is one area they cannot control from the church pulpit.Well done bloggers!!!Let the light shine in a dark place.
God bless you out there and the coming week.May you have a Blessed Chinese New Year with much laughter around the dinner table.
THE DONKEY THAT SPOKE TO BALAAM
To Anony.14th, 6.58pm on REASONS BEHIND, "N0" TO BLOGGING.
There are now countless comments on the malpractises, corruption, misuse of funds for their personal family gains & various spiritual misdeeds of PG & his crony pastors & BOD. But whats the use of these continuous exposing of their "spiritual sins" when till today no one or any groups are able to get them investigated by authorities. They are still roaming about with total freedom and still misusing members funds for their comfort living. In fact, they are now even more arrogant & proud & like telling you people to "catch me/us if you can". They are the "untouchables" now and care not a bit on whats written about them & even snare at those writing about them.
So, will there ever be any strong possibility that these "religous
scroundels" be investigated?
But whats the use of these continuous exposing of their "spiritual sins" when till today no one or any groups are able to get them investigated by authorities
.............................
A COMMENT ON THE ABOVE
I believe the purpose of this blog is not to get anyone investigated and arrested.But the bloggers here have done wonders.It has created an awareness in the greater Body of Christ...to the horrors of many church leaders!!!
Of course, Pastors are not above the law-no matter which text they misuse to support their position.My Pastor used to shout from the pulpit-"Touch not Gods anointed!!" Whenever any questions are raised about the church expenditure and his many overseas trips for preaching,he will use the pulpit to induce guilt feelings among the members.( You can guess who pays for his trips)
But since the emergence of this blog- he has shouted louder BUT has toned down lately... because I presume that he has realized that even though he may be an ordained AOG Dr.Rev. he cannot control or influence the bloggers because the sheep are worshipping in a very wide sphere.
And I praise God for the sheep coming foward to share their personal experiences with their errant Rev's/.
I believe that they are many out there who have only read but have not been bold enough to speak up.As one sheep put it "Just leave them to God-lah!!!).The next generation of believers will one day step into the present leadership.And many Pastors hand down their ministries to their own children as a kind of family inheritance- and their children have the same AOG mindset..And this blog has done wonders in exposing all these to the light.
With the number of sheep who have been abused by the church leadership- it would indeed be a sin to feign ignorance and continue the silence.
" I SAW ALL ISRAEL SCATTERED ON THE MOUNTAINS"- MICAIAH
Most probably another demon possessed AOG Rev..
.....................
I read the above with some amusement.When Jesus Christ cast out the first demon- it was not in some darkened basement with dimly lit candles and worshipers covering their heads with black bedsheets hiding their faces. The first demoniac he met was sitting in the synagogue with other worshippers.It was only when Jesus appeared in the congregation that he shouted out and was exposed for what he truly was.[What has thou do do with us,have thou come to destroy us before our time?]
Demonic activity has never left the churches.In fact it is the preferred place for satan to hide among other worshippers-especially the leadership.This is so true of the AOG system today. For many leaders- their ministry is just a bread and butter issue. Last weeks preaching is just one example- all the words dropped to the ground.Within 10 minutes into the service, I could see several youth already on their phones texting messages- none showing any interest in the pulpit.
The AOG leadership have some serious reflecting to do. If you have not been called into the Pastoral ministry- step down and do something else.Don't be seemingly busy in a vineyard that the Master has not authorized for you.
Blessing of Grace & Peace to all.
Whispers in the Wind
Exsim and Jalilmax related through marriage. One hosts the husbands while the other hosts the wifes. No prizes for guessing which is which.
Posted by Anonymous to Calvary Today at January 16, 2012 4:04 PM
ARISE, SHINE FOR THE LORD
We beg to differ from the comments that the blog comments in the CT and CT2 blogs make no difference to the present status of domineeering PeeGees, moronic henchmen and bootlicking BOD.
It is NOT True at all the PeeGees and family are untouchables.
Even this vey moment as you read these comments, we thank Almighty god that His Truth is released, touching each and everyone, about the dark secrets of these self serving evil pastors and satanic priests in churches, AOG or other denominations.
Be encouraged that increasingly, more and more people in the congregations, have their eyes spiritually opened, have been blessed with Godly wisdom and discernment to see the numerous sins committed by these very same demonic rogue leaders, parasitic religious teachers, false prophets, satanic priests, charlatan healers and the like.
Be assured that more and more, very much more true worshippers are NO LONGER DUMB SHEEP, as they can now separate out Goly truths from lies and half truths spewed at teh pulpits.
Day by day, week by week, month by month and year by year, the members of church congregation are starting realise they have the power to change the present system of abuse of power and position, lack of transparency, lack of accountability, poor governance, lack of integrity, unethical practices, widespread practices of nepotism, cronyism, favouritism and the like. God has made it possible through His miracles the presence of a very healthy climate of spiritual growth and spiritual maturity in churches all over the globe, inculcating the habit of fighting for truth, hope, peace besides justice and human rights. Likewise, the good habit of asking relevant questions by the congregations have revealed many hidden secrets, bringing a spiritual awakening, far more powerful than the Arab Spring Revolution.
Just like the Reformation turn the Catholic churches of the past centuries upside down, this new spiritual tsunami would overwhelm, tearing down the churches infiltrated by the devil and his demons, removing these rogue leaders from places of authority.
Totally Turn Off the Tap (TTOTT) is one such very powerful weapon, giving PeeGees and gang a very strong message that they have lost all the former love and respect from their congregations, that we know they are NOT annointed by God by their past and present actions and thoughts, that we know their messages from the pulpits forever pressuring for money do NOT come from God, who does not discriminate the rich from the poor, God who give His blessings to everyone unconditionally and so freely .
We also noticed that the church congregations do not respond to the urgings of the speakers at the pulpits to say amen or clap, during their sermons about sacrificial giving and the like. Again this shows the unity among the congregation members to reject unholy messages from the pulpit by rogue leaders.
This is the time we have to choose which side we are on - God's or the devil's - no fence sitters, no neutral party, no grey zones, no comfort zones ! No critics pointing fingers at "troublemakers" for rocking the boat. Either we are for God - or against Him, no other way.
Arise, Shine for God! The separation of the sheep form the goats have begun. Just make sure we are on the RIGHT side, God's side.
Know God's nature. Be assured that our GOD never sleeps. He sees all, He hears all, He knows all. He is omnipresent meaning He is everywhere everytime. He is omnipotent, He is all powerful.
God will deal with these rogue leaders in His own time and place.
Don't you worry about a thing about PeeGees and gang. Leave it to God to handle this evil gang. They are NOT "untouchables". No problem at all to our God who created universes and galaxies, zillions of them.
God bless.
CARE TO SPONSOR A MULTI MILLIONAIRE / MILLIONAIRESS FOR THEIR FREE OVERSEAS TRIPS ?
Here we go again. Leading the dumb sheep to the slaughter house. Can you hear the silence of the lambs ?
The poor lambs are led by their noses, if judging by the publicity campaign about the fantastic trip to Israel, organised by cc - Don't miss this opportunity of a lifetime.
Guess what, we dumb sheep will most probably end up sponsoring somebody as rich as those who include multi millionaire / millionairess.
So be careful to check and double check where your hard earned money ends up - not in the pockets of the rogue leaders and their associates and "partners in crimes" !
We remember PeeGee2 already mentioned being "booked" for the 2nd Israel trip. guess who else among privileged few in the upper echelon gets to ride piggy back with those poor victims who were suckered to (most probably unknowingly) sponsor their free trips, fully paid by the "dumb sheep" through ingenious wheeling dealing and cunning negotiations with travel agents, tour organizers, etc !
Bon voyage ! Remember to send us less fortunates your fantastic super holidays postcards. And also show off your true blue Malaysian bargaining skills. and also to flaunt your video shows to those who can only dream of such expensive exotic trips... !
"Don't be jealous lah. God bless us
, yunno ! After all we are the annointed ones. don't you dare touch us !"
lol
Can't help laughing when I remember pastors tell us not to eat in MacDonalds and pay in KFC. They likened themselves to Mac Donalds and other churches or para church org to KFCs. Don't be deceived. Give your money to wherever or whoever God leads you to. We are not some shareholders of a body corporate running some commercial business but we are part of the wider Body of Christ with the common goal of fulfilling the Great Commission.
To Annoy Jan 17th, 9.20am. I am not refering to CT Blog to take the innitiative to instigate investigations of these "religious scroundels". I am refering to many of those who have been commenting & exposing the "sins" of these self proclaimed servants of God. Yes, I know many have benefited from this blog, whose eyes are opened to the unholy acts of these false preachers. But don't you think its time now to act to seek justice & stop them from continuing to "rob & steal" from unaware members & from their corrupt practices by misusing the members funds for their personal gains. Exposing them to bring more people aware of their "religous crimes" is one thing, but at the same time if we do nothing to get them investigated, we are allowing them to continue their "religious crimes" of abusing their power & financially enslaving unaware members. There is a law for us to act. Continuing to expose them , but failed to act against them will get us to nowhere. Many will say, leave it to God to judge them. But God also gave wisdom to men laws to apply & act against these corruptors & law breakers.
MONEY TALKS - SACRIFICIAL GIVING ? LOVE OFFERINGS ? FAITH PROMISES PLEDGES ? TITHES ?
Next time, any invited guest speakers or any of its own home grown pastors turn up at the pulpit, encouraging the cc congregation to "give sacrificially" - DO NOT DONATE to cc or ccc funds.
Please HOLD BACK putting any of your hard earned money into the collection bags - as long as the PeeGee1 is the head of cc. Until today the PeeGee1 DOES NOT practise proper accountability, full integrity, true transparency, godly governance, and not follow the code of ethics, etc.
We have no reasons to know the following:
1. What are the totals, respectively, of each and every collections from the congregation and public ?
2. How the total donations are utilised ? For what purposes, in specific details ? Who gets what ?
When ? For what period ? How long ? How much? For what use/reasons ? Who make such monetary decisions ? Why ? How ? When ?
3. Are the accounts books, supporting documents, etc open to anyone members who request for inspection ? Are they easily and readily available for checking ?
Are auditors, internal and external
assigned to check all the cc and ccc accounts ? Is every sen accounted for ?
4. Are all the detailed breakdown of stipends - including salaries, bonuses, allowances, benefits, perks, extras like church sponsored scholarships, loans from church, love offerings, easily available in full details for members to inspect 5. How soon will the church constitution via an EGM called to be immediately amended to exclude PeeGee1 handling any monetary matters and decisions ?
6. How soon will the unauthorised amendments to the church constitution by PeeGee1 which in effect give him special powers be nullified and treated as void ?
7. How soon will the wrong and wilful misinterpretation of the church constitution be rightfully reverted to its original and express intention concerning the retirement age of 55 be applicable to the PeeGee1 and other pastors, being staff of the church ?
8. How come the specific stipulation of retirement age of 55 is not and was not obeyed as per the church constitution ? Surely the members got the right to vote on this matter via AGM and EGM, right ?
9. When are we going to stand up for our rights in church as members and worshippers in the congregation ?
Meanwhile, Turn Off The Tap !
Do not donate to cc and ccc !
Have a nice day.
Moreover, if your brother sins against you, go and tell him his fault between you and him alone.If he hears you, you have gained your brother. Matthhew 18:15
................................
I think all attempts to communicate to the CC leadership has failed.We, a small Christian group had our share of nasty experiences with our previous church leadership. For one thing- it is almost impossible to reason with these religious devils- especially if you are in the minority.And just how to you talk to titled person who comes across as fiercely charismatic and perceives all disagreement as satanic? No sooner do we express an opinion- and the next Sunday you can bet 100% that he will be binding satan and screaming from behind the pulpit.He is just one incurable religious & diseased psycho nut who has a self elevated view of himself within the church.
And he is not alone with this attitude. There are many others and they function as gods in the midst of the sheep.
His favourite line- " when God wants to say something he speaks to the leader first- as he did to Moses- now he speaketh to the Pastor and then- we pastors pass the message to the sheep.That is the way God operates.
(So in the same manner Moses slaughtered the Amorites , Moabites & Canaanites using the name of God- this Pastor has the same inclination too?)
"As for me and my tiny Chinaman house, we have decided to fold up and flee fast and very far away!!"
Jesus - Kau Meng Ngoh, Kau Meng Ngoh......Fai Thit Chau -lah! !!!
. How come the specific stipulation of retirement age of 55 is not and was not obeyed as per the church constitution .
.................................
Dont you remember SP's statement? " I am not an employee!! The message was clear enough for many of us.The CC Constitution does bind him let alone apply to him.
NOW HERE IS A AOG CHARLATAN ON STAGE. HE IS HOGGING THE LIMELIGHT AND THE CURTAINS ARE SLOWLY DESCENDING ON HIM AND HIS "SINK WITH THE SHIP" CREW!!
CC TITANIC.
"....But God also gave wisdom to men laws to apply & act against these corruptors & law breakers."
A Police Report was made by a Collective group of Calvarites on the Alleged Offence! As per CASE, the Investigation Paper (IP) is still ON GOING. There is no Time BAR for CRIMINAL OFFENCES! The AG can apply for WARRANT of ARREST & serve it anytime before 2013 World Pentecostal Convention ! The CASE IP was not NFA yet ! If it was NFA it can still be REOPENED anytime ! The LORD GOD has GIVEN the ALLEGED OFFENDERS sufficient Time to REPENT & leave the Country with their PASSPORTS! The Secular Legal process is TEDIOUS and embraces PATIENCE !
SLIGHT TYPO ERROR - AMENDMENT
With reference to the blog with heading MONEY TALKS - SACRIFICIAL GIVING, LOVE OFFERINGS, FAITH PEROMISE PLEDGES ? TITHES ? from anonymous JAN. 18, 2012, CT we most appreciate your kind help to please make an amendment to correct a slight typo error BY ADDING the word "NOT" (3rd paragraph, 1st sentence - double negatives - to make sense of the comments) to read as follows:
" We have no reasons NOT to know the following :"
1. what are the totals, respectively .... ?
to
9. when are we going to satnd up for our rights, in church .... ?
Thank you,
and God bless.
NO ESCAPE FROM THE LAW
Today's The Star newspapers carries an interesting article which stated that a fugitive businessman who was on the police wanted list (since 2006), for six years, was finally arrested at KLIA by police, remanded to facilitate investigations into the alleged kidnap, rape and murder of a female UTM graduate. The poor woman victim was reportedly attacked on while on a morning jog. Just when the suspect, an Australian PR) thought it safe to return to Malaysia, the police caught him ! Most encouraging news to us.
It is reassuring that our police do their work so professionally, catching crooks.
Therefore, it is also most delightfully surprising and welcome news that cc members had lodged an official police report against the rogue leader. And that the file remains open for further action by the authorities.
Let us know if that are going to be subsequent police reports made to "update" the police on the case, especially on any alleged irregularities.
May justice prevail. Watch out rogue leader and others, no escape from the law and God ! God is so Great !
RIGHT TO QUESTIONS,
RIGHT TO CLARIFICATIONS,
RIGHT TO GODLY STEWARDSHIP
Keeping in mind that the already oversized gigantic land costs, construction costs, and future furnishing costs, maintenance costs, and other related costs, which most probably may total hundreds of millions Ringgit Malaysia, (someone estimated over RM 350 million at least), it seems only logical and prudent that we carefully re-examine the whole sticky situation.
For example, among the most troubling questions concerning ccc
Question 1.
Who is legally the owner of ccc as stated in the Land Title and Ownership ?
Question 2
Is it cc as the legal owner ?
Question 3
Is it PeeGee1, as sr pastor of cc, and as ccc Project Chairman, considered its legal owner of ccc (being the signatory to these contracts ?
Question 4
Or Is it both PeeGee1 as ccc Project Chairman and JayGee as Project Director being considered the legal owners of ccc, being joint signatories to these contracts ?
We need to ascertain all these facts and figures, to protect the interests of our church against any possibility of fraud.
Meanwhile, we wish to bring to the attention of CT bloggers and public about the notorious headline news concerning the MIED RM 100 million civil suit over MIED trustees, etc - a real sticky legal situation. We also must be reminded about the legal complications concerning AIMST, which story was also carried by the local major news media.
Do we want to invite such similar waste of precious time and money to be embroiled in such legal tussles concerning ccc ? Most of us would like to avoid such legal mess.
We should learn invaluable lessons from the mistakes of others before us, by trying our very best to eliminate all possibilities for wrongful acts to be committed against our church. We should know the grave danger of empowering any individual with too much authority that they think they always can get away with anything, ruling over the church like an autocratic overlord.
As Christians, we must shoulder the heavy burden of ensuring Christian stewardship of God's possessions, including our church's finances. For example,we must block or remove any attempts to commit white collar crimes or criminal breach of trust against our church.
We must support the practice of truth, openness, transparency, godly governance, proper accountability, information accessibility, integrity, democracy, brotherly love, genuine concern and care, within the administration of our church.
We believe now is the time for change starting from year 2012. The answer to need for change ("Yes" or "No") rests solely in our hands over the type of leadership we desire in our church.
Enough is enough !
Meanwhile, Turn Off The Tap !
Stop giving to cc and ccc funds !
Please donate to other worthy Christian organisations, eg other churches, orphanages, old folks homes, drug rehabilitation centres, etc.
SP and his pathetic crew are just hogging the limelight.What is there to hang around for? If these preachers have any sense of honour, they would just call for a vote and see whether CC still wants them around.But SP would never do that. BECAUSE AS FAR AS I KNOW, MOST AOG REVERENDS BEHAVE AS THOUGH THE CHURCH IS THEIR PERSONAL PROPERTY AND THEY ARE THE "TAI KOH".How can a man continue to stand up and preach when there are so many empty seats which was once filled with the faithful?
It seems to me- many of the AOG preachers are a shameless lot!!!SP should seek out the scattered sheep first before striding to the pulpit in a grand fashion in fancy suits and shiny shoes.
The AOG so called Reverends are just beginning to learn that you cannot resort to highhanded ways to quell perceived opposition within church.That is the way of politics.Wharever the differences- the sheep are still part of Gods flock and you cannot boot them out by quoting some Bible verses to justify their actions.Never mind what they say- " JUST LOOK WHAT THEY HAVE DONE!!"
SP is still preaching "COMMITTMENT TO GOD"--a stale message which used to induce feelings of guilt among church people a long time ago.He is just trying to throw dust into our eyes again.
My opinion- be wary of this stale SP manna, and that ridiculous Salesman Pastor.I cringe everytime I see them on stage asking for another "sacrificial giving".Perhaps they should declare their assets and their bank accounts to the congregation before broaching the subject of money again.
The cracks have appeared a long time ago and they are trying to plaster it with more AOG Pentecostal Crap.
God bless your weekend and may you be refreshed by Gods presence.For those going to CC- LEAVE YOUR WALLETS AT HOME.JUST TAKE ENOUGH $$ FOR YOUR LUNCH)He knows that some sheep are awake- so he is trying very subtle tricks this time.He is an old serpent and has a nantural talent for stage acting- and even more dangerous- with a Bible in his hand!
SP is a modern day King Saul in our midst.BEWARE.
[Let us pray for all the scattered & wounded sheep]
In support of Annoy. Jan 20, 9:51am in his quote, "We believe now is the time for change starting from year 2012. The answer to need for change(Yes or No) REST SOLELY IN OUR HANDS over the type of leadership we desire in our church.
Thats why I said continuous exposing them but failing to get them investigaged will get you to nowhere. Action is needed. Perhaps check and update the police report lodged against them.
If questions posed by Anonymous over the shady deal are not answered, then we might fail in future as Anonymous said " to block them or remove any attempts by them to commit white collar crimes or criminal breach of trust against the church."
Pray for us-for we are confident that we have a good conscience, in all things desiring to live honourably Hebrews 13:18
The Apostle Paul carried no man made titles on himself, earned his own bread( some exceptions) and refused to be financial to any Christian group.Of course the worker is worthy of his wages- that is scriptural too-but I suspect it stops there- meaning no bonus,perks, secret entitlements and expensive gifts on the so called Pastors Day.What a difference from New Testament labourers.They only described themselves as Servants of Christ.
The AOG ministers have strayed way off the mark and many of them are simply in it for the money, easy life or they are just plain lost- knowing what else to do.Some of them are plainly abusive and clickish.You invite me I invite you mentality.
Some start Day school knowing there is a lot of money to be made there.Those of you who have children in dayschools run by churches- I urge you to make a call to the Ministry of Education at Putrajaya and find out what is the status of these schools.Dont remain dumb and continue to be hoodwinked by so called pastors who are after filthy lucre.
James- a Bond Servant of Jesus Christ [James 1:1]
CCC is a multi million project that will probably run to RM250 million.
PG is the project chairman and his son Jim is the project director. Father and son knows next to nothing about the building and construction industry. Both have no qualifications in any discipline in engineering such as architecture, structural nor civil. Not a technician nor even a draughtsman. Yet Jim is a project director for a RM250 million project which even a civil engineer with less than five years working experience would not be appointed to the post!
Remember Robert Lim's wife, Marion when at CC said that she was not even in the building committee for their church building and was later appointed as a committee member only.
Isn't this nepotism at its best practiced by PG? Jim will probably be the chief executive for ccc when it is completed.
But as soon as this son of yours came,who has devoured your livelihood with harlots, you killed the fatted calf for him..
Luke 15:30
The elder brother exhibited the same manner of spirit that most of the AOG so called "holy" Reverends possess.My ex-pastor fell due to immorality many years ago.One day we had lunch together and he shared with me his pain since that day.
Since he fell,all his fellow ministers stopped fellowshipping with him and was not even welcome in any church that he had preached before.Even pastors that he did not know somehow knew about his fall and made him feel like a leper whichever church he visited.Finally he had to find his place in the secular world.
The truth about the AOG system is these religious devils with REV titles do not believe in restoration- a ministry which was so much a part of Jesus life.Personally I have never been to a church where a restored minister was preaching.If anyone falls they become the subject of gossip at the teh tarik stalls, cell groups and what other fellowship have you.AND THEY CAN KEEP UP THE SAME GOSSIP FOR MANY YEARS.THEY JUST CANNOT FOR IT.
Of course this Rev's can preach about love & restoration. I have heard the story of the prodigal son preached so many times but its ALL TALK, SHOUT AND SCREAM, RAVE,RANT. This are the empty Windbags who are knowledgeable with the Bible but are possessed with s religious spirit- the spirit of this age.And they are very good at making you part with your money using the Bible.
To all the AOG pastors who in the past have fallen - I want to say that God must love you so much that "He has let the scales fall from your eyes" through your time of personal pain.Dont long for their fellowship. Its unprofitable.
The religious system is tainted. You are only important as long as you serve their purpose. But if the day ever comes when you are bold enough to ask questions- you will be axed without a second thought.Being experts with the Holy Bible they will always justify their actions hiding behind their religious authority.And they are very eloquent at explaining why they did what they did.(The Holy Spirit guided them- of course)
Wonder why I wrote the above. I just wanted to wish all of you out there A Blessed Chinese New Year. AND PLEASE DRIVE CAREFULLY.(and dont make a racket with the fire crackers- others are entitled to a day of rest too)
Now the Pharisees who were lovers of money,also heard all these things and they derided Him.And He said to them "You are those who justify yourselves before men but God knows your hearts.For what is highly esteemed among men is an abomination in the sight of God."
Luke 16:14-15
----------------------------------
We all need money to live and that is the reality.But to only live for money and to be obsessed with it always is a sure slimy pit.May we think about this soberly before we go down into the grave.
This CCC dream is a delusion and is going to bring more pain down the path.May all Pastors take the inspiration from Scriptures and not from the world.
Yet Jim is a project director for a RM250 million project which even a civil engineer with less than five years working experience would not be appointed to the post!
.....................................
HE IS A WHAT???!!!! HAHAHAHAHOHOHOHEEHEHEHEHEH OOOHAHEHE
\THANKS SO MUCH- I REALLY NEEDED THAT LAUGH..HAHAHHOHOHJPOHEHEHE
HOW is it PG is able to assume power upon himself & easily wield his influence over the associate pastors,other pastors & BOD in all the things he does? WHY these people without questioning, just let him to do anything inspite of knowing its wrong? These people are educated and some are proffessionals. Some of the things that PG does are so clearly "unspiritual" and terribly wrong. Can they be that dumb? What we see happening is SURELY SOMETHING OUT OF THE ORDINARY. Is PG able to hold them in his power like a cult leader who is able to influence his members to obey him. Is he being looked upon and worship to be their supreme leader? CULT WORSHIP in Calvary church!!
This just came in over the net:
"Richard Roberts, the son of the late evangelist Oral Roberts, was arrested Tuesday for allegedly driving under the influence of alcohol.
An Oklahoma Highway Patrol trooper stopped the 63-year-old just past midnight driving 93 miles per hour in his Mercedes-Benz.
According to the arrest report, Roberts failed a breathalyzer and field sobriety test.
The officer "detected the strong odor of an alcoholic beverage about Roberts' breath and person," the report said.
Roberts served as president of Oral Roberts University for 15 years before stepping down in 2007.
He currently hosts a nightly television show called, "The Place for Miracles: Your Hour of Healing."
"Our prayers go out to Richard and Lindsay Roberts and their entire family as they face this life challenge," ORU officials said in a statement. "May God's grace help them as they work towards healing."
My Pastor returned from the USA and now had a Dr.Rev. title pre-fixed before his name. As far we know he did not go to any College to study.In fact,if I am not mistaken he has an SPM and a Diploma in Theology from BCM.My family was curious- all this achievements within a week in the USA?
Can any Rev. out there please enlighten us whether this is possible. Our Dr.Rev says he studied for it- but we know he is not telling us the whole truth.
ALARMED
Does anyone know who appointed Jim as a Project Director and what are his qualifications? Is SP trying to start a family dynasty in church? For his own sake- he should step down and move on instead of trying pretend that nothing has happenend at CC.
What a disgraceful state of affairs!!!
Seems just like yesterday that we celebrated Christmas and to day is already the 25-1-2012...whoosh.SP should stop hogging the limelight.Instead he should go fulfill his real calling- that of being an evangelist.Looks like the CCC he is building is just for his own ego booster.He has done more damage in the last few years than many other frauds out there with Rev titles.
REPLY TO DISGRACEFUL STATE OF AFFAIRS
Referring to Jan 25, 2012 1.02 pm, in reply,note that PeeGee1 unilaterally appointed his beloved son JG as Project Director of ccc - despite JG DOES NOT have professional qualifications and working experience as a Project Director.
JG DOES NOT even qualify for the post of a PROJECT CLERK ! With this truth, our conclusion is that JG CANNOT be appointed as PROJECT EXECUTIVE, PROJECT MANAGER ... AND THEREFORE most obviously JG CANNOT appointed as a PROJECT DIRECTOR !!!
JG only got relevant "working experience" as a socalled audio visual worker, period !!!
The misfit in matching JG's TOTAL LACK of years of professional working experience AND skills and knowledge as a PROJECT DIRECTOR is so GLARINGLY DANGEROUS.
Take note of serious implications of a TOTALLY UNQUALIFIED person holding the very responsible position of PROJECT DIRECTOR, being in charge progressive development and construction a mega complex, worth hundred mllions of Ringgit Malaysia - because of serious effects of wrong decision making by this unqualified Project Director of CCC - due to the lack of professional knowledge and working skills - for example the structural weakening, or collapse of any part of the buildings due to shoddy workmanship, due to inferior quality of building materials supplied and used, due to inability to rightly determine the difference among the various types, nature, strengths and weaknesses of building materials quoted and supplied, inability to determine the right pricings among the numerous materials quoted and supplied, inability to control and stop pilfering or being short changed in quality and quantity of materials delivered, lack of negotiation skills, lack of rapport
with suppliers, staff, business competitors, peers in industry, half past six work schedules without following industry practices, not following safety procedures, etc - due to inexperience.
One simple example, wearing of safety helmets are a MUST within the construction worksite - yet PEEGEE1 lied to the congregation "no need to wear safety helmets during the cornerstone dedication service" because the building is already constructed ! Lucky no one was injured or died that day due to unforeseen accidents. Another thing we spotted was that the cc camera man so many times went very close to the edge of the 2nd floor part of the building, he could have fall down and hurt himself - but nobody from was there to warn him of the danger.where was the project site safety officers ? Where was JG as the Project Director, shirking his responsibilities ?
This is a clear cut case of nepotism and favouritism by PeeGee1 to push his son into a high powered specially created position, sinecure, with the expected big fat pay packets, bonuses, salary increments, perks, allowances, etc - all paid for by cc congregation - so mindlessly and graciously - through OUR REGULAR CHURCH CONTRIBUTIONS.
Todate, PeeGee1 by ruthlessly bulldozing through, made sure that there was no opportunity to question, discuss or object his son's JG appointment as Project Director. He already warned any opposition 'trouble makers", if you are not happy with the church, just leave cc ! And PeGee1s really sick demented joke about eating a Mcdonalds and paying at KFC !!!!! Really nauseating mad !!!! he and family treat cc as their personal kingdom, milking their "fat holy cow: dry by deviousmeans, while telling lies and half truths to brainwash us. PeeGees are cult leaders.
And as usual the bunch of betrayers (as rotten as Judas Iscariot) holding the position of BOD stabbed cc in its back by betraying ourt trust and supporting this satanic priest in his evil schemes.
Now you know the truth about this horrible sinful priest.
So how on earth can you still call his God's annointed one ? Wake up from falling into his traps, cc members !
God bless us.
Like father like son, Richard Roberts had missappropriated school money & other improprieties. The same with Calvary church, SP Gunaretnam & his APs had also missappropriated church funds & other improprieties to serve themselves.
If all these charismatic & Pentecostal preachers of the AOG really had the fullness of the Holy Spirit that they always claimed, why then are they continuing to be plagued with all kinds of scandals. Definitely its not the true spirit of God but a false counterfeit spirit that comes from the enemy. The true Spirit of God, which Jesus called the Spirit of Truth always lead us to all His truth and His righteousness.
My Pastor returned from the USA and now had a Dr.Rev. title pre-fixed before his name
..................................
WHAT..... HE STUDIED FOR IT??????? HA...HAAA...HAAAAAAHAHA...HHOHOOOOOOO.....HOHEHEHEHEH...HEE...HEEE...HEEEEEeeeeeee....HEEEEE.HEEEEEEE..WEE.WEEE.....OUGHHooHH...HA..HA!!!!.... MY TUMMY IS HURTING!!!!!!
Richard Roberts? Heard him speak at CC. Basically prosperity type of talk and not biblical spirituality. As such the news of him being arrested for consuming more than the legal level of alcohol and driving mind you, did not come as a surprise.
The late Oral Roberts biggest error was the popularisation of the word of faith and prosperity teachings of Kenneth Hagin (the father of the charismatic movement) in AOG and pentecostal churches. The old or classical pentecostal was strictly word based, never focussed on the earthly successes and prosperity but on carrying the cross, discipleship, and holy living.
But today, Pentecostalism and Word of faith Charismatic churches are synonymous, sharing many similar extrabiblical teachings and experiences, which according to Lee Grady( Charisma magazine) is liken to the burning of strange fires.
Now everybody can dream big, talk big, act big and show how big their faith is.
Another weekend is here and God Bless you all out here.Many thanks for the many writers on this blog and may God grant discernment and wisdom for the continuance of this blog.
My rev. pastor used to hang around the teh tarik stalls for hours and hours talking UMNO & PKR politics,banking and "taking possession of the promised land".Most of it is plain crap- if you ask us-maybe he has not realized that we the youth are not as stupid and inexperienced as he thinks.
Not only has he disapperad from the tea stalls - even the Pastors day(A waste of time and money for the church gullibles) has mysteriously disappeared from the usual church affair- and the disappointment is showing on his face!!
The bloggers here have done wonders with their contributions!!!
Keep up the good work. And may the Lord of the harvest "raise up labourers in his vineyard."
Bye and Cheerio!!
Now everybody can dream big, talk big, act big and show how big their faith is.
...................................
A COMMENT ON THE ABOVE
The above is an accurate description of my rev. Pastor.
Type "richard roberts arrested on dui" on google search and there is a mountain of reports on richard driving above the legal limit of alcohol when driving and speeding.
Whether one is an actor, actress, singers, politician or a pastor, his/her private life is no more their own. They will always be closely scrutinised and their conduct should be strictly above the average person.
ORU has an Honor Pledge and Clause 5 clearly states that: I will not drink alcoholic beverages of any kind. Isn't this a concrete example of "Do what I tell you and not as I do".
Whatever praises PG and the APs in cc had heaped on richard has gone down the drain with his arrest on dui and many controversies on richard.
Jim appointed as the projects Director for ccc. Who appointed him? None other than PG practicing nepotism.
Jim who does not hold any qualifications in any engineering discipline, nor in the building or construction industry, does not have a tinge of shame when accepting the appointment. Really thick-skinned like an elephant!
Can't imagine he sitting at a site meeting with his blank appearance. Those at the meeting will probably be sniggering at him and making a joke out of this outside the room or when away from the meeting.
Han was involved with ccc from the onset. What had he done about it? This is another example of the spineless deacons in cc who only knows the meaning of "yes". It is as clear as water that the deacons in cc are yes-man who have left their brains outside the church when they go to church and are only interested in the ego boosting title.
Mention the fact that Jim knows next to nothing about buildings or construction to an engineer or architect and they probably fall off their chairs.
What is the actual status of the Calvary Convention Center right now? Is it still on schedule to be completed by 2013?
VERY BASIC TEST QUESTIONS FOR PEEGEE1, PROJECT CHAIRMAN AND JG, PROJECT DIRECTOR OF CCC
We wish to invite PeeGee1 and JG to take part in this test which should be considered very simple and easy in view that they hold such highly paid and responsible positions in the ccc project, estimatedly costing hundreds of millions.
TEST TIME: 60 SECONDS
QUESTION 1.
IN WHICH DIRECTION DO YOU TURN TO UNSCREW WHEN YOU NEED TO A SCREW FROM ITS BOLT ?
ANSWERS :
A. CLOCKWISE
B. ANTI CLOCKWISE
C. BOTH DIRECTIONS
D. EITHER DIRECTION IS ACCEPTABLE
QUESTION 2
WHAT DOES THE RED WIRE IN A STANDARD ELECTRICAL WIRING REPRESENT IN THE COLOUR CODED INSULATION ?
ANSWERS :
A. THE RED WIRE IS HOT OR LIVE
B. THE RED WIRE DOES NOT CARRY CURRENT DIRECTLY FORM A POWER SOURCE
C. ANY COLOUR CODING WILL DO, IT DOES NOT MATTER WHICH COLOUR YOU USE
QUESTION 3.
WHAT IS THE RATIO FOR MIXING CONCRETE ?
ANSWERS :
A. RATIO OF 1 CEMENT, 2 SAND AND 3 GRAVEL
B. RATIO OF 4 CEMENT, 2 SAND AND 1 GRAVEL
C. RATIO OF 2 CEMENT, 4 SAND AND 1 GRAVEL
QUESTION 4
WHAT IS THE INTERNATIONAL LINE VOLTAGE STANDARD APPLICABLE TO MALAYSIA ?
ANSWERS :
A. 110V / 60Hz
B. 115V / 60Hz
C. 240V / 50Hz
QUESTION 5
WHICH OF THE FOLLOWING IS THE SAFE WAY TO DO IT ?
A. POUR WATER INTO ACID, THE OTHER WAY CAUSES AN EXPLOSION
B. POUR ACID INTO WATER, THE OTHER WAY CAUSES AN EXPLOSION
C. IT DOES NOT MATTER WHICH WAY, BOTH WAYS CAN BE APPLIED
NOTE; NO CHEATING, PLEASE.
We hope you will please provide us your respective scores via this CT2 blogsite. We hope you will disappoint us. We look forward to your posting your individual scores. We hope you are more than adequately and professionally equipped to handle the two posts you both are currently holding in the ccc project.
Thank you. God bless.
PeeGee1 and JG,
BTW We the congregation hope from now onward, the Project Director could update us weekly during every Sunday service with the progressive reports on the cc project - especially since we are very excited with the detailed development, week by week. We believe this request to be updated by the Project Director himself should be considered normal, reasonable and expected form all contributors to the ccc funds.
Right ?
What is the actual status of the Calvary Convention Center right now? Is it still on schedule to be completed by 2013?
..................................
A COMMENT ON THE ABOVE
You think the leadership is going to be honest and be transparent regarding the above issue? No doubt,many things have been swept under the carpet. From my own experience, I know the AOG so called Reverends will never own up to the mistakes, much less admit them.Maybe they exist on planet Mars and have not flown to Earth yet.
Can you imagine a day when SP and Crew take the pulpit and admit to
the congregation that they have not been completey honest with the church and that they had made a terrible mistake? These are the modern day charlatans and the AOG is full of it.The CC project is struggling financially but the leadership will never admit it.No matter what that Salesman says.
Instead what I heard SP say boldly "CC does not need to borrow a single cent from the Banks"--now thats prefessional liar and religious con talking.If that is ever true- why did CC attempt to borrow money from the banks in the first place? Thats why the arrangement with Exism came about...bacause the Banks know about the contentions within CC.
This is the mentality of the AOG leadership. They tend to think that those who attend church are morons who would just about believe anything that is told them.
Just start off with "I have a vision from God......"
This verse jumped out at me "Enlarge your tents...."
Caleb prayed ' Give me this mountain..."
It is always about possessing something. The fact is it is a covetous spirit.I have never heard anyone in church testify, let alone the church Rev. say
"God told me to give half of my goods to the poor..."
"I read today " he who has 2 shirts give to him who has none.. and I have decided to obey.
This kinds of testimonies are non-existent in the modern church.All that is in our midst is a covetous spirit lurking behind nice sounding sermons.As the visiting preacher shouted ' God wants all of us to be rich...I dont think he made the diamonds for the devil..!!! If you belive that...standup and shout Amen and claim whats ours!!!
(And there were many screaming Amens coming from the gullibles, nit wits and "Bodohs dalam gereja.A young lady behind me - was just screaming at the top of her voice ... AMEN!! AMEN!!YES LORD!!..incidentally she drives a kancil to church.
I do not want to be pessimistic but CC is on the downward slide. SP and gang would have to move on and find some other church that wants them.For RY he can definitively be a used car salesman.No doubt about that.
...................................
Those visiting Broga village---be extra careful when ordering food. A fried wanted to eat tortoise, but later discovered that it was actually monitor lizard, covered under tons of onion peels and dried chilies.It was just so disgusting!!Yuch!!
Mention the fact that Jim knows next to nothing about buildings or construction to an engineer or architect and they probably fall off their chairs.
.............................
THESE GUYS ARE REAL JOKERS!!!!
Hi
I do agree with Anonymous to Calvary Today 2 at January 26, 2012 10:44 AM
Jim has NO EXPERIENCE WHATSOEVER in
handling project. Perhaps, SINCE
this is PG'S KINGDOM, he can do
whatever he wants.
True, Jim IS NOT EVEN QUALIFIED AS
PROJECT CLERK what more PROJECT DIRECTOR. A PROJECT DIRECTOR IS ONE
WHO HAS A QUALIFICATIONS PLUS PLUS
EXPERIENCE. He or She MUST HAVE A
DEGREE IN STRUCTURAL ENGINEER OR
other areas of Engineering WHICH
ARE RELATED TO THE TITLE.
Anyway, NOW in CC, PG'S KINGDOM
RULED. So NO POINT WORSHIPPING THERE
ANYMORE. Or those are still there,
turn off the tap.
Posted by Anonymous to Calvary Today at January 29, 2012 4:49 PM
Talking about God wants you to be rich; I know of a pastor from a non pentecostal church who was so full of joy and praise for God because someone gave him a Kancil car.His gratefulness to the donor and God was deflated by an AOG/WOF charismatic pastor who belittled his Kancil. The AOG pastor told him if he had a bigger faith he would have got a much bigger car. Now everyone can dream big, think big, talk big, act big in WOF( word of faith) churches. And so came about the birth of CCC. Acting out big dreams and vision.
Those visiting Broga village---be extra careful when ordering food. A fried wanted to eat tortoise, but later discovered that it was actually monitor lizard, covered under tons of onion peels and dried chilies.It was just so disgusting!!Yuch!!
...................................
Yes- we have "kena teruk" before in the sleepy town of Broga.As we sat in a certain restaurant, an old lady whispered into my ears "Oi Sek Fei Shi Mow?-after some clarification- we were made to understand it was wild civet cat- a protected species) My friend, from a "Confess & Possess" church said that all creatures belong to God first and we could partake with thanksgiving.According to him,God owns "all the cattle on a thousand hills...and that includes all the civet cats" He went on- Peter saw a sheet descending from heaven with many unclean animals and he heard someone saying " Arise & Eat".When Peter refused,the voice further said'What God has cleansed- you must not call unclean." Christians do not follow man made laws.
(Something SP believes- since he does not consider himself equal to an employee but a rank above somewhat like"Moses, Elijah or one of the prophets)
Anyway,my friend ordered the dish- and then it arrived- something steaming covered under ginger,onions and chillies in a clay pot.While eating as he scrapped into the pot,there was this little feet suddenly popping up and staring at him.And it did not look like it belonged to a jungle cat!!! It was then that we realized that we had been conned by the old woman!!!!We left the place in disgust as we don't know what we had eaten!!!And we were slapped with a bill of RM126.00 - just 2 people-tit pan tau fu,baby kai lan, and the 3rd dish- which we are not sure until this day what we ate.It was such a terrible and angry feeling as we left Broga.We felt so cheated!!
Anyway- what to do?? I heard one preacher say we have to praise God for all things.I tried hard to praise God but I could not- instead I ended up cursing the old lady because I was so angry!! My friend avoided looking at me-his face had almost turned purple.
Well Praise God Anyway.Just a Gentle Reminder-Don't always quote Bible verses to justify what we do-Bye-
Something SP believes- since he does not consider himself equal to an employee but a rank above somewhat like"Moses, Elijah or one of the prophets)
...................................A COMMENT ON THE ABOVE
Its not just SP who has that mentality. The fact is,most of these self deluded religious devils think that they are "a rank" above the others.They may not say it directly,of course-but demonstrate that attitude in many subtle ways.I guess the "Rev" title gives them in a different mindset.And thats the origin of the AOG disease.
I am always wary about any church that has a display of collective leadership, but is in fact a 1 man show.The Rev.-the power man- is hidden behind many other faces. There is no NT pattern to support such a view.Its just an AOG system.
The work of Christ has suffered much at the hands of these Pastors who lord it over the church as though it was their own property.All Pastors should be under a church Board and keep him away from handling church money.It is this influence over the finances of the church that gives tremendous leeway to throw his weight around.If you are discerning enough, most of those who sit on the church Board are in fact- the "Yes, Sir" kind of men.Any disagreement with the SENIOR PASTOR" and you are shown the door in a matter of time.
SP has demonstarted this AOG attitude so well....and throughly.This humble Pastor who arrived at CC's doors,who built his fame and fortune using church money,just grew too powerful and by the time the church realized it,it was too late- he had already brought out the AOG axe.
Its a real pity when these so called Reverends forget their humble beginnings- where God had brought them from.Most church services its their hour of power. And because they use Jesus Name- people tend to think that they are preaching Gods messages.That gives them much room to manuever and to deceive.Throw out all the Bible verses and the sheep are are taken in.
It appears what it ipportant to SP & his pathetic crew is that the new building must come up.Never mind about the axing,half truths from the pulpit, and all the Yes Men appointed to support him.
(our special compliments to RY- who escorted Liza out of the church...shameful behaviour indeed!!!For a Rev. who is on the church payroll...eats bread by money given by church sheep...you can roughly guess this 'tai koh" mind )
Anyway 2012 is here and this controversy has not ended.All that I can see is there are many Backslidden Rev's in town controlling the church pulpits and deperately trying to ward off all resistance by the sheep who have woken up.
We hope all those attending AOG churches have learnt many lessons from this unnecessary episode.Learn the lesson well.
Bye/
Our Pastor, Dr. Vincent Yeoh is a real beloved man.Our family has known him for many years.He is the edifying sort.Talk to him, and you go way feeling that suddenly there is an answer out of that particular problem.The feeling of being ministered.
He has a great love for missions and he has rubbed this onto the church.But most of the places he visits are poor places,like Bangladesh, Myanmmar and so on.
There are some nasty experiences said about some pastors mentioned here,and we thank them for opening up and talking.But that cannot be said about this man.He is very accountable and easy to approach and talk to- no airs about.All we can see is a Servant of the Almighty.
May God Bless and Protect this man from ill- will wherever he goes.We know we came under his ministry by the will of God.God bless his soul.
Maranatha!!!!
PTL for the affirmation of Pastor Vincent Leoh (not Yeoh?) He is a very unusual in the AOG world. He has a genuinely earned doctorate and not an honorary one. AOG pastors have the tendency to flaunt their honorary doctorates. Secondly he is still a bachelor. Good or bad I don't know. He has a group of elders and deacons who are not awed by his spiritual authority. They provide the necessary checks and balances against the absolute corruption of the pastor that comes from the spiritual authority and absolute power that many AOG pastors exercise. Most important he is subject to reconfirmation every two years by the members. Most AOG churches have done away with this requirement leading to the building of personality cults and dynasties. The pastor cannot be removed if he has a board of yes men and women.
They are many other AOG pastors who are sincere, humble and really servant-leaders called of the Lord to shepherd His flock with dedication and in humility. Respect them, love them and work with them. Is your pastor like that? Check his or her heart. Humility and love of the people cannot be faked for long.
I read this here today.
They are many other AOG pastors who are sincere, humble and really servant-leaders called of the Lord to shepherd His flock with dedication and in humility. Respect them, love them and work with them. Is your pastor like that? Check his or her heart. Humility and love of the people cannot be faked for long
...................................
I REGRET TO SAY THAT MY PREVIOUS PASTOR WAS A DEVIL IN DISGUISE.ABUSIVE OF OTHERS AND PROUD OF IT.100% AOG denomination material.(WE HAVE MOVED AWAY FROM THAT DEVIL SINCE THEN)I AM REMINDED OF THE WORDS OF THE LORD JESUS
"HAVE I NOT CHOSEN YOU TWELVE?YET ONE OF YOU IS A DEVIL. JESUS commenting on the 12 disciples.
A MOST DREADFUL VERSE IN THE BIBLE
Romans 11 :8
Just as it is written "God has given them a spirit of stupor,Eyes that they should not see And ears that they should not hear to this very day"
..................................
The above indictment was not written about some Satanic religion but of Gods chosen people - the Jews- who resisted the Works of the Holy Spirit in Jesus until the end.Stephen last words were" You stiff necked and uncircumcised in heart and ears.You always resist the Holy Spirit; as your fathers did - so do you!! Acts 7.51 The Words of God are everlasting. We have the same spirit today. Put up fantastic buildings at great cost and describe them as churches.But the Spirit of God is absent.
The one thing Christians need to pray for these days is discernment.A Christian must sense the spirit beyond the "full of promise" sermons.
There is no doubt that within the AOG circle of power, a Rev's importance is attached to the size of the church he pastors.The bigger the church he has built with others people money,(don't mention this to him.Its all his God given vision, his faith and his obedience & commitment)the more power he yields over the flock and the Rev.becomes unquestionable. After all who are others to be questioning them?
The AOG's equation is this- shouting out a sermon from the pulpit is proof of the anointing.If need me- shout others down too.It is proof of their power.When cornered- they withdraw into their inner circle of power within the AOG for some help and advice.
During the CC crisis, a strange phenomena occurred. Several local AOG Rev faces emerged at CC's doorstep to try to neutralize the sheep which had become suspicious.
In CC's heyday- none of them were invited to preach on a Sunday.This is a fact all CC sheep know. Why the sudden appearance of these rev's at CC's doorstep? The reason is not simple to discern-these bandits are trying to throw dust into our eyes again,speaking out nice sounding phrases to soothe the flock & calm down the sheep.. Its indeed frightful when the sheep begin to ask pointed questions about the leadership.
The system is ridden with a spirit of stupor, deaf ears and blinded eyes- a chastisement from above. And these are the Pastors who occupy Moses seat today.(there are exceptions-few in number)
The Scribes and Phraisees are seating in the seat of Moses.Therefore do whatever they tell you, but do not follow them.
Matthew's Gospel.
Jesus comment on the synagogues of his day.
God Bless your worship this week. Remember Christian- don't just ask for a blessing from God- be a blessing to someone at church tomorrow.Your words, conduct and service, from ushers to those who greet at the door - all ministries are very important to the whole Body of Christ.God bless you exceedingly this year!! Bye.
there are many Backslidden Rev's in town controlling the church pulpits and deperately trying to ward off all resistance by the sheep who have woken up.
................................
We at the office started laughing when we read the above.One blogger here put rightly put it this way "Check his or her heart. Humility and love of the people cannot be faked for long"
The trouble is,when we see this Revs talking up there- we assume that they demonstrate that same qualities in their private life.One Rev.Pastor I knew looked spiritual enough=until I heard him demeaning another Christian privately.That was nothing short of whoremongering.And they are aplenty within the AOG.My wife & daughters heard quite a few things at cell groups.(I avoid the cell groups like the plague)
It is a known fact that the AOG grapevine is very strong and alive with the latest dirt reported.When a scandal is exposed,the Christians hear about it even before it is properly investigated.The result is most of the nasty things we hear is picked up by some rumourmonger within the church.It seems it is a great pastime for many churchgoers.( church demons?)
The last time I heard some Crap from another church going fox, I asked him"Have you prayed for her? Lets pray for her right now against waggging lips and a church that will welcome and restore her without any condemnation."
But unfortunately, oftentimes the AOG leadership is tainted with this evil. To me this is a sign of an unclean spirit because it is cruel to be running down others and always talking about the past misdeeds.Its demonic activity among Christians.
God above has a weak memory when it comes to repentance from his people. "Their sins and their lawless deeds I will remember no more." Hebrews 10:17
He is a truly Great God-worthy of love,respect and worship-because when He sees repentance from his people- suddenly God develops amnesia- "..I will remember no more."
Now when God does not want to remember the Crap-what are we doing-keeping it in mind and talking about it? Who are we? What thinkest thou of thyself?Are all our backs clean? I praise God for my redemption in Jesus.It is further written-
Who is he who condemns? It is Christ who died,and furthermore is also risen, who is even at the right hand of God, who makes intercession for us. Romans 8:34
He is a God who embraces all His chidren back.A Father of Fathers in a cruel condemning human society.
God bless all the bloggers and visitors here.The CC crisis was not necessary.But through it we have heard many voices speaking.And in my opinion,it would be downright stupid for any AOG Reverend to be demanding that this blog be shut down.Let the voices be heard.
Grace and Peace be to you.
House of Amnesians.
Heard from CNN news today, that the scandal tainted Eddie Long, bishop of a mega church was invovled in a "Torah" ceremony where members crowned him as "King". Although he later apologised for the ceremony to atone himself, the damage was doned. This act symbolises that when the Anti Christ who always want to take the place of "god" appears in the last days, he will convinced the people of the world (christians & others) to worship him as "kings of kings" and "lord of lords". The Bible had clearly warned believers there would be a rise of false prophets(those that claimed to serve Christ) in the latter days.
We are today seeing many of them in todays churches where even the so called christians believed them to be servants of God without any conscience of knowing that they are actually idolising someone as a religious "cult figure". Is this happening in Calvary church? With so many indications, it sure does.
Beware believers! of these false prophets in your churches, for the day will come when they will deceive you into accepting & believing that the coming of the anti christ is the true Messiah. Imaging, members are even willing to accept Bishop Eddie Long to be crowned "king" in that Torah ceremony.
Eddie Long - Nothing new, Just another strange fire burning in WOF Charismatic/Prosperity churches. It's happening everyday. Reject and stay away from them.
Go back to basics and scriptures and sound doctrines and the gospel the apostles taught and not another gospel these charlatans propagate.
Imaging, members are even willing to accept Bishop Eddie Long to be crowned "king" in that Torah ceremony.............
............................
I WILL GIVE YOU SHEPHARDS AFTER MY OWN HEART.
The above just proves that church leaders are capable of doing anything with their self delusions.Self glorification is what it is.As one blogger adviced- when going to church dont leave your brains outside!!Plainly the Bishop mentioned here has some psychiatric problems.And Christendom is full of it- David Koresh,Jim Jones and the so called prophets on the local scene.Christians cannot just blindly enter a church these days.Ask for Gods guidance to lead you to a particular church.
I have visited many fellowships which are just centered around their emeritius pastor.And the Pastor behaves as if he is the king.If you dont come under their authority- then we are not welcome. It is all about the issue of control.If you cannot be controlled- it makes them feel uncomfortable.I will resist these church devils until the end.They have particular ministries and I can accept that.But if he starts asserting himself,centering church activities around himself,from the so-called pastors day so called sabbatical then we have to run from another AOG Rev. who has psychiatric problems.
Christ has set us free- dont be bound again by a yoke of bondage.
God bless all the Christians out there working.Its amazing how time flies by so fast.Just a question from all of here at the office.
Where is the blogger who writes under " ANOTHER SMALL FRY." ?
DR.REV. EMERITIUS PASTOR DIOTREPHES (A.O.G)[ aka MADHAT DIOPREPHES by some)
3rd John 1:9-10
9.I wrote to the church,but Diotrephes,who loves to have the pre-eminence among them ,does not receive us
10.Therefore,if I come I wilL call to mind his deeds which he does , prating against us with malicious words.And not content with that , he himself does not receive the brethren,and forbids those who wish to,putting them out of the church.
...................................
All the above qualities mentioned above are found in many AOG Rev's of today.
1. Firstly they love to have the pre-eminence- his name must be on the very top and he is the most important person within the church.
2. Prating with malicious words- running down others ( usually due to own insecurity)
3.does not receive the brethren. You see,whatever this man says- it goes. If he does not want to welcome other Christians- thats the end of the story.Period.
4.Forbids those who wish to... putting them out of the church.
This madhat pastor described above not only bossess over others ...he literally .. those who came into church--- he puts them out.
I can think of 2 AOG Rev madhats who have the same spirit above./
Dont just accept what they say- read Johns guideline here and you can discern what manner of spirit you church rev. has--pastors heart or that madhat Diotrephes.
Have blessed weekend.
Quoth for thought:
" A man may be an heretic in the truth, and if he believes things only because his pastor says so or the assembly so determines without knowing other reason, though his belief be true, yet the very truth he holds become his heresy."
- F. W. Farrar-
" Spiritual maturity is not the ability to see the extraordinary, but the ability to see the ordinary through God's eyes."
- Frank Viola -
Greetings to CT & its readers!
Another year is here. What are we going to do? PG & Co continues to prosper and plunder CC wealth like no tomorrow and the "regular" congregations continue to give them the $$$ willingly.
Are we going to "tutup kedai" - after saying all that we need to say since 2009 at least; or, are we going to continue "exposing" and "preaching" to a stubborn group whose minds have been made up to serve PG & Co forever?
Shalom!
PLim
Posted by Anonymous to Calvary Today at February 10, 2012 1:07 PM
'Alabaster flask n SP sandiwara'
...a woman came up to Him with an alabaster flask of very expensive ointment, and she poured it on His head..."in pouring this ointment on My Body she has done it to prepare Me for burial...wherever this gospel is preached in the whole world, what she has done will be told in memory of her" (Matthew 26:7,12-13 RSV)
...a woman came with an alabaster flask of ointment of pure nard, very costly, and she broke the flask and poured it over His head..."She has done a beautiful thing to Me. She has done what she could; she has anointed My Body beforehand for burying. And truly, I say to you, wherever the gospel is preached... " (Mark 14:3b,7-8 RSV)
Recently during one of my quiet time, the scene where SP literally broke a vase to so-called illustrate the above at the 2004 Easter Presentation 'In His Power' at Putra Stadium, Bukit Jalil came to my mind. Further discussion with fellow Christians revealed some startling things/truths of which i like to share here with fellow bloggers and readers of this blog.
1. What's the main point of this incident in the Bible? It is about the ANOINTING AND PREPARATION OF JESUS'S BODY before His ultimate Sacrifice for the Salvation of mankind. And in both the gospels, JESUS VERY CLEARLY TOLD all those around including His disciples THIS TRUTH when they began to question what the woman did.
And yet SP used it as a platform to divert the attention to the woman's 'sacrifice' and instead of emphasizing the Ultimate Sacrifice of Jesus during that Easter presentation, SP used it to launch CCC fund-raising.
And since then, at every evangelistic Easter and Christmas presentation, CCC has been very much the focus.
Come on, SP and all the rest, please LET JESUS BE THE FOCUS OF EVERY EVANGELISTIC EFFORTS OF CC, not CCC.
2. In the sandiwara, SP literally broke the vase at Putra Stadium. Let me ask you...how can you pour the ointment after you broke the flask containing it? If you want drama please don't twist Scriptures! After discussion with fellow Christians i came to the conclusion that the breaking here could mean something like opening or breaking some sort of a seal on the cover/cork like breaking the seal of some expensive perfume or wine.
For years after that 2004 whenever i come across the passage i tend to remember that drama by SP and miss the real teachings of what Jesus wanted to teach us UNTIL RECENTLY. Just imagine how many thousands at Putra Stadium missed the real focus becos of SP's obsession with CCC.
3. During the sandiwari SP emphasize so much about the 'sacrifice'/'sacrificial giving' of the woman and from there SP and his gang has not cease harping and harping on sacrificial giving.
Again please don't twist the Scriptures to suit/achieve your purpose. Yes, the the Scriptures did say the ointment was expensive but never was it implied it was sacrificial giving.
4. The woman's name was not mentioned. Yet what she did was so meaningful and significant. Just imagine, the PREPARATION OF LORD JESUS'S BODY FOR THE ULTIMATE SACRIFICE FOR MANKIND!!!
Jesus could have summoned any of His disciple to do it. The implication? God can use any of us to do His work; big or small.
5. ...wherever the gospel is preached...
Can we see the connection? The gospel can only be preached becos of JESUS ULTIMATE SACRIFICE!
So this incident very clearly relate to the PREPARATION OF JESUS FOR HIS ULTIMATE SACRIFICE SO THAT THE GOSPEL CAN BE PREACHED ALL OVER THE WORLD.
And that dear readers is the focus of this episode.
Dear fellow bloggers and readers of this blog. Together let us enlighten others of the very possible financial disaster CC is heading for and to TTOTT becos there are still many in CC who are swallowing hook, line and sinker everything that is dished out at the CC pulpit!!
ANOTHER SMALL FRY
It is well known that one tactic that PG is playing is the game of endurance. If people has given up in exposing him, "moves on", left and silent, then the evil deeds of PG will be slowly forgotten. Afterall, he has the stage to pretend, and preach whatever he wanted, while others are scatter and focus now on their attend church. In a long run, PG and gang will escape. People will forget the past, and he will continue to fleech tithe from the congregation and donation form public. The world will know him as Tan Sri, AOG superintendent, great giver, host of World Pentecostal Conference 2013, adviser of NECF, pastor of richest church, and founder of CCC. As for CT, the number of articles published has even decrease. In this fallen world, evil often win.
To PLim,
It is our (the 400 axed members and others with first hand experience) duty to continue on as witnesses to tell others, especially the current lost and blind remaining followers of CC, of the misdeeds of PG and cronies. Whether they listen or not is another matter. Our job is to relentlessly let it be known; God will do the rest in His own time. We are only His instruments.
Specially for PLim
U asked about continuing to expose and preach to......
Many know about the full facts about the falsehood of many CC leaders but THEY STAY because they feel they can make a difference or that God has not told them to leave.
Do you agree they make a difference? I have personally received replies which do not hold water. Does not God give us wisdom to make the correct decision? God speaks sometimes through His word, audible or through our thots.....do we just hear or listen and take action.
What fellowship as light with darkness?
All pastors need a congregation...why be their congregation when they do not love their sheep?
For many of us who leave, we are
1. either do not want to go to other churches because ONCE BITTEN TWICE SHY OF GOING TO OTHER CHURCHES.
2. went to other churches and the leadership there recognise that they love the Lord and encourage them to join the church and serve in various ministries.
Looking back, being sidelined and later axed is a blessing because when we leave for good, other doors are opened to us.
Ask our Father God to show us where He prefers us to worship - CC where there is no solid food or elsewhere where pastors really are annointed to preach the Word of God to encourage and equip us to serve Him?
It does not matter now what TTG does, it is important for you as to what you should do.
Dear brother PLim
and Warmest Greetings to all bloggers, readers and supporters of this blog whether openly or otherwise
...PG & Co continues to prosper and plunder CC wealth like no tomorrow and the "regular" congregations continue to give them the $$$ willingly.
Are we going to "tutup kedai"...
Dear brother please do not be discouraged that things do not seem to be going the way that we hope for. It may even seem to be getting better for SP and his cronies.
For eg. the Jan 2012 figure of RM346,698 is a lot even prompting RY2 to say so happily in his 2nd sermon on 05/02/2012 at cheras and i quote '350,000 is a lot of money!!' unquote
This high figure could be due to a number of factors i.e.
1. spillover from dec 2011 which i understand was rather low forcing RY2 and PO to appeal to the cheras sheep that the missions budget not met...
2. fear of missing God's blessing if you don't give. i still remember very clearly at the 2011 Christmas Evangelistic Presentation that PO reprimanded the congregation especially those who has not fulfilled their pledges even going as far as to say if they are in trouble or if they are not receiving God's blessing, it is becos they have not fulfilled their obligations like tithes and pledges. How disgusting to say the least!!!
Dear pastor PO your twisted comment has forced me to lose whatever respect i still had for you...i was hoping against hope that you being among the most senior AP will bring some glimmer of hope to CC!!
Anyway your seniority in CC may be ..... becos if you look carefully at the seating arrangement of the group photo at the back page of Calvary News Jan/Feb 2012 issue, seated in the front row with SP and P are all APs except JG and he occupying a very significant seat just below you!.
3. The relentless bombarding and the instilling of fear and guilt of the consequences of not giving in every sermon since the very 1st week of 2012 as follows:
-08/01/2012 (mission sunday)
IS from india...
* CCC will be one of the Christian Wonders of the world!..(read: feel good factor, Pride!)
* CCC Spectacular Vision!!
* invest your best in mission ..(read: sacrificial giving to CCC)
* remember sept.11 if you were the victim (read: you better give before you die/too late..fear!)
* I guarantee ON THE WORD OF GOD YOU WILL REGRET HAVING GIVEN LESS!!! (If this is not twisting Scriptures to achieve what you want, i don't know what is)
PO...
* I want everyone to return the card for mission and ...THE COMPLETION OF CCC (Read: what a feel good factor of having a part in the building one of the Christian Wonders of the world!!)
-15/01/2012
PO...
* Give to mission ... THE COMPLETION OF CCC
* As you give God will bless you
* Choose wisely... what you choose is what you get!... consequences of wrong choice..(read: you better give for completion of CCC otherwise...)
TO...
* Everyone to have a part in this WONDERFUL OPPORTUNITY...GIVE TO MISSION!! (Read: feel good factor for the wonderful opportunity!)
-22/01/2012
PO...
* CCC contractors submit request for early payment tis season of celebration...a challenge to the faith promise partners to give so that NO NEED TO DRAW DOWN AND TO LESSEN BANK BORROWING(Read: a new taktik? contractors facing financial problems?)
KSC...
* you need a bigger church...CCC
-29/01/2012
TO
* New Year-give differently!(Read: whatever different ways doesn't matter as long as you give! and more giving!!)
Dear brother PLim, IF NOT BECOS OF THIS BLOG AND THE MUCH ENLIGHTENMENT IT BRINGS I WOULD DEFINITELY HAVE SUCCUMBED TO SUCH SYSTEMATIC PSYCHOLOGICAL BRAINWASHING.
So let's continue to blog and share with those our close friends so that more will be enlightened! Yes there are many who will mock us even resent us.
ANOTHER SMALL FRY
Read the book: "Toxic Faith" by Stephen Arterburn & Jack Felton. It identify what the Spiritual Abuse is and help christian to avoid its danger. This book may open the eyes of those trap in abusive church.
You wish the SPs and APs will set the example by giving 50% of their income..
Peter Haas knew he had a financial challenge on his hands when he got a report on the giving patterns of his fast-growing Substance Church in Fridley, MN, and discovered that his 8-year-old daughter was one of the top givers in the church.
“She out-gave a third of our congregation for the year,” says Peter, noting the relatively young and largely unchurched demographic that makes up Substance’s membership base. “I have friends at Southern megachurches who seem to draw people who were born tithing. We don’t get those people.”
The economy’s ongoing limps and struggles are taking their toll even on growing churches, but Peter Haas and others are finding creative ways to address the challenge.
Setting and Voicing a Personal Example
Short of deploying his generous 8-year-old to teach giving principles, Peter Haas’ leadership team has embraced the challenge of teaching generosity “in a life-giving way” to its largely unchurched audience.
“People are so over-sensitive about money, it’s hard to talk about it,” Peter says. “I don’t think I ever remember teaching about giving and generosity without getting a mean letter. So it’s easy to get insecure about talking about it.”
But since Peter and his wife Carolyn have always attempted to give away upwards of 50% of their income, and he leads his staff to live simply and generously by example, it made the topic much easier to address.
“When people hear that you live like that and you challenge them, you’re able to say ‘Dude, we’re only talking about 10%--seriously’,” Peter says.
Half of our staff drives cruddy cars, we have very modest houses. It’s a different way of living that gives you permission to speak boldly about money.”
Peter says Substance Church also addresses the financial needs of a younger generation—what he calls “the most financially undertrained group of people ever”—by continuously advocating financial management small groups and classes that utilize Dave Ramsey’s Financial Peace University material. Every time leaders focus on generosity, giving in the church increases by 25%, Peter adds.
“We think sound financial principles are so fundamental to everything in your life,” Peter says. “So we are constantly trying to get people into these groups so they understand basic stewardship principles, living modestly and living smart. It’s only going to strengthen the financial base.”
Bravo Another Small Fry on February 14, 2012 3:17 AM
Continue to share your observations so that people are aware of these pastors!
PO, I have knowned you for years, and this goes to SK,TO & RY. But today I have lost my respect for you for I am extremely dissapointed that you & your fellow APs have become apostate, incapable of any discernment and no courage to stand up for God for His truth & righteousness. The reasons why so many have left CC clearly indicated that something must be very wrong with the church leadership. If you all are humble & faithful servants of God, don't you think you all should check upon yourselves where & what has been doned wrong and help the flock in your care. But instead you all in your pride & arrogance & your self righteous attitude ignored and shunned the members to the point of even supporting PG's idea of sacking the 400. Where is your "love thy neighbour" attitude that you all preached. Surely you have not lived by what you preached. PO, you & your fellow APs ARE A BIG SHAME, serving not the Lord, but your own belly. Money & CCC have become your idolateries.
May God have mercy upon you & your fellow APs.
Since many pledges were made out of pressure ( due to preaching of 'judgement' for 'robbing' God or desire for 'multifold returns') and since these teachings are unbiblical and doctrinally wrong, do not feel guilty if you now come to the realisation of the truth, that you have made pledges based on the premise of a false prosperity gospel and irrelevant compulsory giving of OT laws. And do not feel guilty if you now decide not to honour your pledges, because they were made on the basis of unbiblical teachings in the first place. If you continue to honour your pledges after realising the above, then it is basically giving under fear and compulsion which goes against NT teachings.
I was in that position once but the truth of God's word has set me free from the fear and guilt formerly instilled by the pedlars of the false prosperity gospel and OT laws of tithes. Only give what you have purposed in your heart. Be a cheerful and generous giver only because of gratefulness to Him who saved us, Never give based on guilt, fear and pressure instilled by preachers who are not concerned about your financial circumstances. Do not give emotionally without regard to your families. God don't want you to be emotional , irresponsible irrational givers. The NT tells us that if we don't provide for our family and relatives, we are worst than an unbeliever. Did you ever hear them warn you of that ? No, they only instill in you the fear of 'robbing' God . Therefore, brethen beware and check the Word of God for yourself.
NT tells us that if we don't provide for our family and relatives, we are worst than an unbeliever. Did you ever hear them warn you of that ?
................................... A COMMENT ON THE ABOVE
God bless the writer above - whoever it is.God bless you manifold!!
I have been in AOG churches for about 30 years and never once have I heard the above from an AOG pulpit!!! In the AOG system- it's all about giving to their own visions and fleecing whatever else you can from the sheep.The so-called Pastors Day - created by these titled foxes is just one example.
Dont be deceived by their guilt inducing sermons on money matters. God is not in it at all. Now lets take a look at these backslidden religious devils occupying Moses seat. Do you see anyone in Calvary living a sacrificial life? Never mind about that. Do you see anyone in there who is known for his simplicity of lifestyle??
These guys are earning their bread by deceitful means.They should get into business out there.As soon as the pressure was on- the first so-called Minister who bolted from the scene was none other than Pam.
CC and crew are nothing but a family concern with all the power centralized in PG and a spineless tag-along crew.
Many appreciation to all the bloggers here.Let the little beams of light here dispel the darkness.There is a much needed change in the mindset of the AOG religious devils- and we cant fight these men who occupy the pulpit. Within church- whatever they say- stands.So let the resistance begin from here.
Many of these men and women are nothing short of tyrants who have built their nest within the religious system.And they have their own little clicks within the system and have great authority within the system. If we say anything within the church- we will get axed. So lets use this medium to get the other sheep to wake up and ward off these robbers disguised as ministers of Christ.
Regards.
The nest time RY talks about sacrificial giving- tell him to sell his new CRV and give it to the CCC building as an example to the flock.
How did these ministers degenerate into a den of thieves?? Its the Judas syndrome- the lure for easy $$$- even to the point of selling off Jesus.Thats what has happened in CC.
The nest time RY talks about sacrificial giving- tell him to sell his new CRV and give it to the CCC building as an example to the flock.
..................................
WE THOUGHT WITH ALL THE PASSIONATE MONEY APPEALS FOR CC,SP AND GANG WOULD HAVE DOWNGRADED THEIR CARS,SOLD OFF THEIR FANCY HOMES AND MOVE TO A MODEST NEIGHBOURHOOD AND START EATING SIMPLE MEALS.
INSTEAD WHAT WE SEE IN THAT SALESMAN RY IS UPGRADING TO A CRV IN THE MIDST OF ASKING US TO GIVE SACRIFICIALLY!!HE CAN AFFORD TO SEND HIS CHILDREN TO AUSTRALIA TO STUDY WHILE OUR CHILDREN HAVE TO GO TO LOCAL SCHOOLS AS MANY OF US CANNOT AFFORD IT.
WHICH LEADS ME TO ASK A MORE TROUBLESOME QUESTION-WHAT KIND OF SPIRIT IS CONTROLLING THESE SO CALLED PASTORS? I THINK THE SPIRIT OF THE WORLD HAS CREPT IN AND TAKEN HOLD OF THESE MEN.BEWARE.
GOODBYE.
PO, you & your fellow APs ARE A BIG SHAME, serving not the Lord, but your own belly. Money & CCC have become your idolateries.
...Anonymous February 15, 2012 11:40 AM
A) May i add SP to money & CCC having become your idolateries.
When 2012 dawned upon us, i was hoping that this new year will bring new positive changes to the APs; having given up hope for change in SP. But the way the APs preached and conducted the first 7 worship services for 2012, i observed they(APs) have become worse, even to the extent of mimicking SP's style.
Let me share some examples that i observed.
RY in cheras on 05/02/2012
"Someone say amen" "Someone encourage me"...(Read: come on! Please lah say amen! Please lah give me some response!) isn't this so typical of SP? Yes, SP in almost every sermon will plead for amens from the congregation and so often sarcastically add he doesn't know if they (the congregation) is dead or alive!!! Even going as far as to say their response and amens will encourage him to preach!!!
SK in cheras on 12/02/2012
"Are you with me?!!" i don't think i need to say anything more on this. honestly i am sick of hearing this becos it has become such a common cliche of SP's sermons.
i think we have had enough of such remarks. Enough is enough and we certainly don't need copycats or mimics to torture us with more of such dumb remarks.
Dear APs, if you are good and your sermons are God-given and God-inspired the Amens will just flow and the congregation will be inspired too.
B) Dear readers of this blog, i don't know what is happening at DH and DP but in cheras for 2012 the focus has been CCC, faith-promise giving...giving and more giving. Even more intense than last year. i don't really know whether it is becos the financial situation of CCC is so critical that such desperate measures had to be taken.
i hope the coming CNY evangelistic cum lunch at cheras will not turn into another CCC fund-raising activity. And as usual like a good boy, PO has spoken glowingly of SP being the speaker for this activity while promoting it. What a shame.
Don't you think instead of highlighting SP, PO should be emphasizing on how to pray and prepare those invited so that they will be ready and ripe for harvest when the Word of God is shared???
Btw just out of curiosity i wonder whether SP, PO and other APs who attend are paying for the lunch becos dear PO you had emphasized and i quote " The talk is FREE but the LUNCH YOU HAVE TO PAY!!!"
i just don't understand why can't PO or the organiser get a chinese-speaking speaker?!!
C) Dear PO, i often wonder how precious are evangelistic programmes to you??? For example last week in cheras during collection of offering some activities were flashed on the screen. One such activity was the recruitment for Easter Presentation.
PO, you DID NOT EVEN MENTION THIS IN YOUR CLOSING COMMENTS! Isn't EASTER PRESENTATION MORE IMPORTANT THAN CCC??? i have noticed this quite a number of times.
Whatever it is, i sincerely hope all bloggers will continue to share your observations and insights not only here but with those who don't know about this blog.
One way is to share via email.
And in your sharing, don't be discouraged if your closest friend label you NUTS! i had more than one such reactions. One of my best/closest friend called me 'chii siin' (cantonese for crazy!!) when i share this blog with her.
ANOTHER SMALL FRY
SO WHAT TRIGGERED OFF JUDAS ACTIONS..??
Matthew 26: 12-15
When she poured this perfume on my body,she did it to prepare me for burial.Truly I tell you,wherever this gospel is preached throughout the world, what she has done will also be told, in memory of her.”
Then one of the Twelve—the one called Judas Iscariot—went to the chief priests 15 and asked,“What are you willing to give me if I deliver him over to you?”So they counted out for him thirty pieces of silver.
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Firstly,the dramatic act of SP breaking a so called alabaster flask on stage reminded me of a Broadway Show in New York. Probably he could have got some positive reviews.
Secondly linking that circus act to his own sacrificial nature is laughable-to say the least.Unfortunately,many sheep were taken in.
Thirdly his act of breaking the flask can mean 2 things- he is ignorant of the Bible or he is deliberately twisting the Scriptures for maximum stage effect.Of course,the lady unsealed the cork to pour out the contents on Jesus- breaking it would have poured out the contents on the ground.Again- another successful AOG deceiver on stage.Sorrowful state of affairs.
So what triggered off Judas actions? A woman had anointed Jesus...unknowingly for his burial." She did it for my burial.." [Judas]What???Your burial???Is this what your
Kingdom of God is all about?? You are going to to your death?? So all these years I have followed you for nothing?? No earthly Kingdom? And no Finance Minister post for me in your Kingdom?Oh no.. I made a mistake following you.Judas had heard enough.You know the rest of the story.It was the straw that broke the camel's back.
Like many Pastors today many enter the ministry for the power,the money and the ambition.And with an impressive looking Bible in their hands,and a solemn looking Pulpit- it gives them an aura of authority before the flock.
But as the years go on and they realize that not all their desires are going to be fulfilled...they turn from Jesus to what they really desire..money,power, titles, overseas holidays.And start the endless money appeal from the sacrificial sheep.
I tell you the truth, many of these AOG Pastors need to be born again.Some I know don't even have a Shephard's heart...but they stand up to preach before the flock.
My Ex-Pastor is a dangerous man. he is just so full of anti- Goverment rhetoric. And spreads it to the youth of the church who silently listen to his poison.A cunningly shrewed AOG Reverend.
I cant change him without him waving the bible at me threateningly.So we as a family moved away to a safe distance.Our condolences to those who have Pastors like the above.
Son of Man...take up a Lasmentation against Israel..
[Ezekiel]
INSTEAD WHAT WE SEE IN THAT SALESMAN RY IS UPGRADING TO A CRV IN THE MIDST OF ASKING US TO GIVE SACRIFICIALLY!!HE CAN AFFORD TO SEND HIS CHILDREN TO AUSTRALIA TO STUDY WHILE OUR CHILDREN HAVE TO GO TO LOCAL SCHOOLS AS MANY OF US CANNOT AFFORD IT.
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He not only sent his children to Australia to study, he even flew over to celebrate his son's 21st birthday.
Hmmmmm .... "cho mo si tu kei ho low, ngor tai ngor tu oi chin hong" (in Cantonese for "pastors' income is not to bad, I think I should change profession").
That statement was made by the Contractor who change CC's carpet some years back & was asked to change PG's carpet in his bungalow. I wonder what the Contractor saw in PG's bungalow to cause him to make such a comment about switching profession. That's why if you drive past PG's bungalow in Bangsar, you can't see it as it is blocked by high walls (Cantonese say "ng kin tak kong" i.e. (can't be shown in the light").
Don't pick on people, jump on their failures,criticize their faults. - unless, of course you want the same treatment.
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The above was what SK preaches in his sermon entitled "Don't just act like a christian - be one." SK you and the others should asked yourselves what failures & faults you all have committed to cause members to express their grievances against you. If you all were to truly lived by what you preached , being good role models, then people would respect you and none will comment or cricized you all. You all should know that you are leaders of the church and you will be watched & judged by your actions, how you treat others & whether you live by christian principles as a leader. So don't blamed others for the comments they made, but blamed yourself. Spiritual unrighteousness had been committed in the church especially by SP & family and members would have thought that you all should know and act against unrighteousnes, but instead you all turned a blind eye to his lies & deeds. Spiritual abuse had been committed against members and they are hurt, but you all showed no compassion or any feelings & failed to reach out in love for them. So SK, how do you think members would have reacted?. You preached this sermon, DON'T JUST ACT LIKE A CHRISTIAN - BE ONE." Preached it on yourself SK,"don't just act like a christian, be one.".
I was asked why I no longer attend Calvary Church by a someone who still attends.
I replied with a simple question - why should I, how could I when the church axed me for wanting to puruse truth, transparency and good governance? I asked another question when she said I should learn to forgive and forget - how to forgive when they took this action of cutting 400 people and a long serving deacon Dr Lum who love the Lord AND THEY SEE THERE IS NOTHING WRONG WITH THEIR ACTIONS?
PG2 often stresses as far as she and her husband PG are concerned they have done nothing wrong......
what will the Lord say of themj
good and faithful servants?
or you have stumbled my sheep for whom I died on the cross?
I know of some sheep whom they stumbled who no longer attend any church......
Surely SK is aware of this too - but is he concerned for those who lost their way? Ah ha....maybe if they are willing to part with their millions?
I asked another question when she said I should learn to forgive and forget -
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There are lots of Christians hurting out there and remain unhealed because of the above attitude-forgive and forget!! So the wrongdoer feels he has done no wrong and continues to hurt others.Forgiveness has its limits- otherwise the first person to greet us at Heavens entrance will be none other than - Judas Iscariot, Ted Bundy,Hitler & Pol Pot.
The system has hurt many Christian and continues doing so.It is high time that we resist these church demons adorned with Rev Titles. And many thanks for the bloggers here who have shared their experiences.I have learnt much since this blog saw the first light of day!!!
Sign in California- "RATTLESNAKES-KEEP A RESPECTFUL DISTANCE"
THE WAY THINGS HAVE TURNED OUT- WE MAY SOON HAVE TO ERECT ANOTHER KIND OF SIGNBOARD- "AOG TITLED SNAKES --KEEP A RESPECTFUL DISTANCE"
DISGUSTED
That statement was made by the Contractor who change CC's carpet some years back & was asked to change PG's carpet in his bungalow. I wonder what the Contractor saw in PG's bungalow to cause him to make such a comment about switching profession. That's why if you drive past PG's bungalow in Bangsar, you can't see it as it is blocked by high walls (Cantonese say "ng kin tak kong" i.e. (can't be shown in the light")..............................
COMMENT ON THE ABOVE
Oh Come on!! How can you be so suspicious? After all he is an an AOG DR. REVEREND. I assure you, most likely he has a few wooden chairs and a table inside his house,a worn out sofa set,still sees black & white TV and sleeps on a thin mattress on the floor identifying with the poor around the globe. And he still uses the same sarong he used for the last 20years.
There are no fine suits and expensive ties in his wardrobe.Simple shoes.He still wears Bata RM9.90cents. The high walls were erected so people may not see his simplicity of lifestyle and be humbled by his sacrificial temperament for the sake of the gospel.
And oh yeah- his last updated bank balance only showed RM 2.97 cents. The rest he has given away sacrificially to Missions. SHAME ON YOU BLOGGERS THAT YOU HAVE NOT FOLLOWED HIS GODLY EXAMPLE. SHAME ON YOU AGAIN!!!
Quotation from P Yancy's " What So Amazing About Grace"
"Grace abuse stems from a confusion of condoning and forgiving. To condone an evil is simply to ignore it , to treat it as if it were good. But forgiveness need to be accepted as well as offered if it is to be complete: and a man who admits no guilt can accept no forgiveness. "
My toes are laughing at the 'excuses 'given by Anonymous of Feb 20 at 5.16pm.
Have you been invited ever to their Bangsar residence at Bt Bandaraya? If you have - then u are at liberty to say what you said. If not, then please check your facts before u assume they are 'poor'.
Do you attend CC? If so, have you observe the branded suits, Bally shoes PG wears when he preaches? How can you say there are no fine suits in his wardrobe?
Do you not see the diamond rings and earrings PG2 wears and the expensive dresses?
Does a 'poor' pastor seats in Biz class when flying?
Ah well, hiding things behind their high walls are definitely not cheap stuff - posh cars and other classy stuff.
Pls check facts before u blog and be a responsible blogger.
Hmmmmm .... "cho mo si tu kei ho low, ngor tai ngor tu oi chin hong" (in Cantonese for "pastors' income is not to bad, I think I should change profession").
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ONE AOG REV.I KNOW WAS A LAZY BUT QUARRELSOME BUMP HANING AROUND THE TEH TAIK STALLS AND THROWING HIS AOG WEIGHT AROUND. BUT HE HAS SINCE DISAPPEARD AND SEEMS TO SPEND MORE TIME IN THE OFFICE THESE DAYS.AND WE SUSPECT IT HAS SOMETHING TO DO WITH THIS BLOG.KEEP UP THE GOOD WORK BLOGGERS!!!LETS NOT BE COWED BY THEIR BULLSHIT.
Paul declared himself a bondservant of Jesus Christ, but Eddie Long declared himself King. Wow, what contrast, bondservant Paul vs HM King Eddie Long. Many Pastors today are easily influenced by what celebrity preachers teach and do. So many now dream of their own mega kingdom and empire with a huge membership pledging loyalty to their kingship. No more servanthood, that's old theology that belongs only to old mindset people like Paul.
Despite much have been said here, nothing actually changed. PG and gangs still spend church money waywardly, they probably able to build CCC, the stumble and hurt remain hurt with no compassion from AOG board who support PG, majority of the christians community know nothing about Calvary church crisis, most AOG speak bad about TTG & its effort, and evil remain ruling over CC and most churches. What's next? It cannot be worse than this.
While reading a book, came across this Quote:
"When leaders become empire builders, beware. They may soon resemble ferocious wolves. attacking anyone inside or outside the church who disagrees with them, not merely on central tenets of the faith but even on minor personal preferences" (cf Acts 20:29-30)
Another Quoted message:
"Christian congregation should ask first if a given message
1. Glorifies God or bring praise merely to the speaker
2. Is it in accordance with the scripture?
3. Does it build up the church rather than dividing it?
4. Is it spoken in love?
5. Is the speaker in obvious submission to the judgement and consensus of his or her Christian audience?
6. Is the speaker in control of himself or herself?
7. Is there a generally instructive nature or ethos to the message?
To Anonymous on February 20, 2012, 5.16pm.
If SP is living in a simplicity LIFESYTLE, HE DONT NEED TO HIDE. behind the HIGH WALLS. REMEMBER YOU MENTIONED HIGH WALLS?. He is wearing Bata shoe? You must be kidding. I was told by someone (who is so observant and knew the brand)many many years back, he is already wearing Italian shoes.
Why do you think the CONTRACTOR want to change profession to be a pastor? You MEAN if a pastor is living in proverty or a simple lifestyle like you mentioned, THE CONTRACTOR will say such?
THINK AGAIN. THINK AGAIN.
Posted by Anonymous to Calvary Today at February 26, 2012 10:22 PM
....they probably able to build CCC..... Yes, likely they will do but with no regard to the cost or long term financial consequences. Pride will claim victory and proclaim that God has vindicated them. Robert Schuller was a proud man and so was Oral Roberts but their financial extravangance has a secret date set in the future for payback time.
On page 3, Calvary News mar issue,it was stated "Senior Pastor also expounded on the theme that we are sons and not servants in the Kingdom of God."
Isn't this contrary to what we have always been taught. PG has set a dangerous trend inn his distortion of spiritual teachings and is dragging Christian down with him
Do a Google search on " are christians a servant of God" and you will find that Christians are servants of God and this concept is accepted the world over.
Missionary Rosa Brooks founded Servant of God Ministries, Inc. upon her return from Kenya and Ghana. hen she was sked if she was a Pastor? she replied no, I am just an obedient child of God doing what God told me to do.
Talk of sacrifice? This is what she said. "I had no money of my own; so I sold some of my furniture, jeweelry and clothing and even borrowed money to make this trip. I slept in the heathrow Airport to make my flight the next day to Kenya.
Will PG emulate such sacrifice? No! Luxurious bungalow in a gated expensive location in Bangsar even though the road is a short dead-end road, expensive suits, Italian shoes and flying business class with PG2. And the APs are not far off. PO has an imported Mitsubishi Lancer and RY upgraded to a new Honda CRV and celebrated his son's birthday in Australia.
A....they probably able to build CCC.....
B….Many know about the full facts about the falsehood of many CC leaders but THEY STAY because they feel they can make a difference or that God has not told them to leave...
The above two comments are written by writers of this blog and from my observations will very likely come to pass.
A. Yes it is very likely that CCC will be completed, at least the auditorium so that SP and his gang will be able to showcase to all the AOG gang of the world one of the Christian Wonders of the world as IS from india puts it during his so-called mission sermon at CC on mission sunday 08/02/2012.
As for the full completion of CCC including the full finishing, i doubt it. i may be wrong but what better opportunity than the AOG world conference to launch at all out fund raising to suck the CC sheep for more and more funds!
Remember the cornerstone service last october at the CCC site?? What was the main purpose of that event? SP and the rest of his gang including the BOD launched not one but THREE FUNDS FOR CCC!!! Just imagine a local small cornerstone service can be used to launch three funds. i just can’t fathom the opportunities a world event presents.
i asked myself why all of a sudden Calvary News becomes monthly? Dear readers of this blog and the rest of the CC sheep, please use God given wisdom wisely to discern the reasons behind whatever the top administration of CC does and that includes everything (the sermons by the APs, the cars that SP and the APs drive, the houses or rather the mansions they live, they and their children’s lifestyle, change of CN from bimonthly to monthly etc etc etc...)
Dear readers and CC sheep, looking at the Calvary News March 2012 issue, besides the cover which relates to SP’s article the rest of the important and prominent pages(centerspread, back cover and inside back cover) are used to project CCC and fund-raising for missions{read funds for completion of CCC} !!! Not only that, the pics and writeup on CCC on the back cover certainly instill a wonderful feeling of pride and motivation to further sacrifice for CCC especially to sheep that swallow hook, line and sinker whatever that comes from the pulpit!.
Incidentally isn’t this akin/liken to idol and blind worship?
By going monthly, CC sheep can expect to read more ‘testimonies’ like those on page 10. Not to mention more encouragement and motivation to sacrifice for CCC. I hope this inference will not become a reality and that Calvary News becomes a real blessing for CC sheep and not to glorify certain individuals. Please look at page 14 and use your God-given wisdom to discern. As for the other pages I leave it to you.
B….i know they are those who stay becos of other reasons (like the others in the family not ready to move to other churches, having bad experiences, long bonded friendship with other members etc.)
Yes, I do agree that to a certain extent some do not make a difference but they are those that make some difference though may be small, for example sharing this blog with sheep who are open.
But these I can clearly observe. The following are some examples of why SP, APs and BOD can continue to milk the CC sheep from cheras…
Total allegiance to SP and the APs. Try say anything other than praise praise and more praise for them(SP and gang) and you will be fiercely rebuked as if you are possessed by the devil!
Ask anything concerning the actual cost of CCC and you get this retaliation… “How much is your contribution? You give a lot ah?? If not SHUT UP!!” . i once got this when I enquired this matter from a rather senior and seemingly very gentle and Godly sister-in-Christ.
“Don’t say anything bad, otherwise you will be judged. God has anointed them to be pastors. God has given the CCC vision to them".
It is becos there are so many like the above who are so spelled bound by SP and his gang that they(SP and gang) can continue to do what they are doing.
ANOTHER SMALL FRY
Anonymous Feb 8,2012 9:11PM
Yes definitely we are servants of God, as Paul clearly declared himself as BOND SERVANT of Jesus Christ. Now whose words do you trust ? Your pastor or the Apostle Paul? They upgraded themselves as "Sons of God", King, Prophets, Apostles etc whatever they like to proclain themselves to be as long as it is not the lowly servant.
Even Bernard Blessings declared himself "prophet" and the CC leadership swallowed sink and hook. Brethen, be discerning at all times.
PO I was right after all when I told you several years ago that the doctrines and the spirit behind these Pentecostal churches of the AOG is unscriptural and not from God. These were the reasons when I told my cell group several years ago that I am leaving CC, and they were shocked, but today almost all of them had also left.
Isn't it strange that these CC AOG pastors are just incapable of spiritual discernment and cannot even understand simple spiritual righteousness. Because they are not being filled with the right & true Spirit of God, but a counterfeit spirit of anti christ.
The following are some examples of why SP, APs and BOD can continue to milk the CC sheep from cheras…
...continuation
(i)...an actual conversation...
ASF(ANOTHER SMALL FRY):Hi Mrs L, as a very senior member of CC, what's the actual financial situation of CC n CCC?
L(SENIOR CC MEMBER n CHURCH LAYWORKER):Hi, i heard they need a lot of $$$
ASF : ya, so far any figures n breakdown as to the cost?
L : ya...lol..so far no details oh
ASF : with the cost running into millions don't u think its only proper to let the CC members know? at least the rough figures like how much paid so far, for what $$$ was paid and how much more needed...
L : yes, u r right
BUT ANYWAY I M SURE THEY (SP n HIS PEOPLE) KNOW BEST. THEY n THE BOD ARE EXPERIENCED n THEY KNOW WHAT THEY R DOING. WE NO NEED WORRY. GOD WILL SURELY BLESS!!!
Dear readers of this blog, Mr L(the husband) is one member who reads n knows a lot about this blog n the financial mess CC n CCC is in.
And yet she(Mrs L) and Mr L can b so naive n sweep everything under the carpet as if it is only a trivial matter.
Yes so true as one blogger observed that they are those who knows the whole story yet still so blindly obeys!! And God knows how many Ls are there in CC.
(ii)…another conversation soon after the Dec 2011 EGM…
ASF : Another EGM!(Refering to the Dec 2011 EGM)
A : To approve the sale of CC commercial land
ASF : Isn’t the approval already passed by members during the 23 September 2011 EGM?
A : No no you wrong, the Sept. EGM only to inform the members. This one to get the members’ approval.
B (another church leader): Ya? I didn’t know…anyway I was not at the EGM
A : You know what! Other churches had to borrow to build much smaller buildings but CC really ggeng!!!(Cantonese meaning great), CCC costing 300 million don’t have to borrow a cent! PAYMENT IN CASH!!! WOW!!! REALLY GREAT!!!
Incidentally A is one senior CC member n businessman from cheras who once bought a pure silk shirt from China n gave to PO as a present. PO wore it during the Chinese evangelistic meetings (24-25 September 2011). You can see the picture of PO wearing it on page 12 Calvary News Nov/Dec 2011. if I am not mistaken A was also involved in the construction of Pusat Aktiviti Cheras.
Wonder how many As and Bs who just blindly vote at the AGMs and EGMs
(iii)…last Sunday at cheras before the CNY service…
C (another lay leader rushing down from the 2nd floor) : …panting…You saw SP?
ASF : Oh yes just arrived
C : anybody received him? anybody accompanied him up?!
D(a lay leader from DH rushing down also and carrying corsage) : Where’s SP? Came already or not?
ASF : Went up already and nobody accompanied him
C and D : ahh….(both looking disappointed)
Respect for good and humble church workers is definitely proper but when it borders on blind respect and enslavement, then something is definitely not right. Sadly there are so many such Cs and Ds in CC.
Two Sundays ago, SP preached in cheras and i quote : “CAN SOMEBODY SAY AMEN..(so very weak response hardly audible…only one clear one as usual from bro. Alan of cheras)…YOU ARE NOT RESPECTING THE WORD BEING PREACHED! (raising his voice slightly)…YOU ARE NOT RESPECTING THE MAN!(read demanding respect while he is preaching)…
He continued “WHEN WORD OF GOD IS PREACHED, DON’T GO OUT!!!...DON’T WALK IN AND OUT ANYTIME YOU LIKE!!!”… “SOMEONE SAY AMEN”
And can you imagine, some really say Amen to that!!
As I have written before respect is earned not demanded. And when the Word of God is twisted as observed by Anonymous February 28, 2012 9:11 PM do we with God-given brains blindly say Amen??
And yet there are so many with the above mentality so much so that SP, the APs and BOD can just reign freely. After all anyone who dare to question will be mercilessly removed.
MAY ALMIGHTY GOD CONTINUE TO BLESS ALL THOSE WHO USE GOD-GIVEN BRAINS WISELY
ANOTHER SMALL FRY
. PO has an imported Mitsubishi Lancer and RY upgraded to a new Honda CRV and celebrated his son's birthday in Australia.
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can someone out there please tell me how I can become an AOG Rev?? I earn only RM3,500 and only enough for food and pay the bills.I have to go out and makes sales everyday from 8am- 6pm. This morning, after some Bible reading,I feel called to enter into the ministry.This verse jumpred out at me." Anyone desires to be a bishop, he desires a noble thing!!
On Pg3 Calvary News March issue, it was stated "Senior Pastor also expounded on the theme that we are sons of God and not servants in the Kingdom of God"
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The above is akin to the false doctrine of Pentecostalism called "Manifestation of the sons of God" This heresy appears in many forms under many names like Manchild Company, Joel's army, God's army or the Sonship. It relates to the heresy of the Latter Rain Movement which claimed that "Pentecost was the former rain or outpouring of the Holy Spirit & the church must yet receive a second Holy Spirit visitation. At this time, the Sons of God will be glorified & manifested to all as they establish the Kingdom on earth before Jesus Christ bodily returns." They claim that they will be annointed & empowered believers in the last days to bring the church to unity and perfection & take over the earth for Christ to produce the Spotless Bride in readiness for Jesus at His return. THIS IS A FALSE DOCTRINE & THE BIBLE DOES NOT SUPPORT IT. This heretical teaching promoted by pentecostal pastors of AOG are deceiving & leading many unaware christians astray. Biblical truth is this, the Bible teaches that ONLY JESUS can deal with the wrongs of this world and set things right...not us. No man can ever built and establish a perfect Kingdom ready for Him to return. Only when Jesus sits on the throne after His return, will He establish His Kingdom on earth.
So this "Sons of God" teaching by SP is unbiblical. Believers, beware of these Pentecostal AOG pastors, they are not teaching biblical truth according to the Word of God. Don't believe every word they say or teach. Discern with your heart and check the Word of God for wisdom & truth
To anonymous March 1, 2012 2:15PM
To me I think you are a brotherin Christ. Persevere, for all decent careers are pleasing to our Lord and Saviour. the person can hold the head high with utmost respect and dignity among fellow brothers and sisters.
Let shameless CC senior pastors and so-called associate pastors continue to support and associate with PG his family and the board of deacons. Being ascribed with various labels like night-club bouncers and "poodles" are certainly not complimentary for a position of an associate pastor.
Many of these pastors have behaved uneasy rather uncomfortable and could not look straight in the eyes of anyone of the 400 + one unceremoniously axed members when by chance they were to meet anywhere outside. Their guilty concience shows clearly during such encounter. Honestly, many of APs cannot compete for a decent job in the marketplace. Tragically, this is the truth unless there is willingness to take a deep pay-cut sacrifice.
Therefore they shall continue to twist the Word, intimidate and squeeze for cash from the pulpits.
They cannot continue to mock God. Brothers and sisters, be patient. In His time. In His time.
can someone out there please tell me how I can become an AOG Rev??
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You have to enroll in one of their Bible classes.After 3 years you get a Diploma.The you get into one of their churches and find a Patron Saint(A Senior Rev)inside the denomination- who is usually a man of influence.He is a man of connections and for the time being- you must be his shadow.
Be extra careful not to disagree with him,in matters of church doctrine or personal practice,as in the last upshot he is the one who can recommend you for the Reverend status.Needful to constantly remind yourself,many of these crafty foxes have very puffed up egos.Like the Ceasar's they believe the Sun evolves around them. If you have to disagree on a point,or suspect something amiss-only keep it in your mind- never express it in words.
And remember,never exhibit any moral failures.It will spread like wildfire and even before you know it,even those in the cell groups are whispering about it.And worse than that-your scandals will never be forgotten by these religious devils- even if God above forgets it.It will be talked about even after your death for years to come.
Lastly,tread cautiously-These Reverends are not as humble and harmless as they seem.You would be surprised to see to what length they would go to even the score if you are stupid enough to offend them.And never make the mistake of questioning them in public-they will take it very personally and will hit back at you and later justify it with some vague Bible verses.
We feel glad that you desire to be a rev.and wish you good luck.
You are going to mine gold-- there are many dump sheep out there and if you can talk- you can always say God spoke to you to build a million dollar church and they will fall for it.The bigger the crowd -the bigger the collection --- and that's extra cash for you.You don't have to pray for your daily bread anymore- because now you have a cash cow to milk.And the milk is aplenty!!
Always play on the sheep's mind that your are not an employee but only serve God.This is very important.Because this is the most effective deception in the Rev's arsenal.Ignore this advice to your own peril.If the sheep wake up- just keep calm and carry on.They have no power on their side and they will calm down.Find a Sunday- and preach " Lets Forgive & Forget" and get real fiery --and give the altar call- the sheep are taken in this con game again.
Wishing you all the success. Bye for now.
HOUSE OF AMNESIANS
Honestly,many of APs cannot compete for a decent job in the marketplace.
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This blog has done wonders in creating a much needed awareness in the greater Body Of Christ.
Leave them alone- they are blind guides to the blind.. is a most practical response to these so called Reverends. The blogger said it right,very few would succeed in secular life. Though they are in the spotlight within the 4 walls of the church and sound terrific-outside they would be " kei to ngap kong".RY would definitely excell in selling insurance,or some latest Chinese herbal medicine supposed to cure all diseases under the sun. Without a doubt- he is excellent in leading the sheep to the milking sheds for "sacrificial giving" again.What a complete disgrace!!No sense of shame!!
Recently Dr. M's comment to another prominent lady leader in UMNO, who is currently under investigation by the MACC -"RESIGN BEFORE THE PEOPLE KICK YOU OUT"And the leader stepped down pending investigations - which has not ended yet.
But Church leaders are not shamefaced.They can carry on in spite of accusations relating to church finances. And they will not volunteer themselves for a proper investigation.Instead they start hiding behind the Church Constitution and continue with their endless manipulations usuing the pulpit. Looks like Church leaders are no better than the secular guys in power.THIS IS EVIDENT BEFORE OUR EYES AND IS A CAUSE OF DISGRACE.
The CC episode has demonstarted for everyone that AOG leaders are not credible people.In fact, many of them are hurtful by words, conduct and deeds.For a start all AOG churches must redraft their church constitution and ensure these parasites have no direct say in the church finances.Their terms of Pastoral leadership should be made reviewable once in every 2 years or so.All churches need to look inot this specific area.
This is recommended for the whole AOG denomination.It is my opinion that most church sheep are docile, submissive and commited to without knowing what. That phony altar call.There is nothing of that sort in the entire N.T. This state of affairs gives the so called Reverend tremendous room to manuever with his Bible and his sacred sounding Rev title.
The Rakyat will decide who comes to power in the next elections.May the Bersih episode also start from the churches.
Grace & Peace to you from God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ.
Are Christians servants of God? This is taken from the website of Anglican Diocese of Melbourne:
Every Christian is a servant of God and has a role to play in the lay or ordained ministry of the Church. Lay ministries range from helping out in the various ways on an honorary part time basis, to full time work as a Stipendiary Lay Minister.
Ordained ministries include Deacons, Priests, and Bishops.
So, how can the general Superintendent Emeritus and as the Senior pastor of the so-called fountain-head church say "we are not servants in the Kingdom of God". If this is not twisting facts, what else then?
SP claimed in his sermon that they are "sons of God" and not "servants of God." The term "sons of God" do appear in certain passages of the Bible. But sometimes the way we interpret them could be different from what God is trying to imply. It had been established that "sons of God" in Hebrew means "servants of God." These AOG preachers misuses this term "sons of God" to create their own false theology like the "Manifestations of the sons of God" or the "Sonship" or the "Kingdom Now" theology where they claimed in the end times they will be equip with God-like powers to conquer & perfect this sinful troubled planet to set the stage for the coming of Christ. They have exploited the Body of Christ with this heresy, and yet you have people who called themselves born again christians believed them and fall for this stuff.
To be correct, we who serve God, are servants of God, and we are to be called children of God.
THE HOLY BIBLE AND THE HOLY QURAN
NUMBERS 15-32-36
While the Israelites were in the wilderness, a man was found gathering wood on the Sabbath day.Those who found him gathering wood brought him to Moses and Aaron and the whole assembly, 34 and they kept him in custody, because it was not clear what should be done to him.Then the LORD said to Moses, “The man must die. The whole assembly must stone him outside the camp.”So the assembly took him outside the camp and stoned him to death, as the LORD commanded Moses.
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Basically the Islamic Scriptures is the OT rewritten in Arabic.I will not discuss which Book is superior or whether the latter Book is inspired.What is noteworthy is the harshness of the Mosaic law.I personally find it repugnant that this guy lost his life for gathering firewood on the Sabbath.But under Moses, the law is the law.
In the Cross the handwriting of ordinances written against us was wiped out.Just recently the Saudi authorities sent an empty plne to KL on a specific mission- to pick up a Saudi national who had allegedly blasphemed their prophet on Twitter.One can just imagine his feelings of the accused when the plane enters Saudi Airspace.certain death was awaitinghim.
Romans 11-22 The Christian message-
Consider therefore the kindness and sternness of God: sternness to those who fell, but kindness to you, provided that you continue in his kindness. Otherwise, you also will be cut off..
I find the present day church messages are lopsided.Its always about the love crap or the money appeal.
Pastors please preach a balanced message.Even though our sins have been pardoned at the cross-still there are consequences for our misdeeds.THIS IS A MESSAGE THAT THE CHRISTIAN YOUTH OF TODAY MUST HEAR FROM THE PULPIT.
God bless you all.
From the Diary of King David
Twinkle Twinkle Great CC
How I wondered about your lofty greatness
High above the sky so high
Like a diamond in the sky
But lately your shine and sheen has gone dim
And many wonder about your gradual decline
From so high now the sky has dimmed for you-?
The truth is out-it was a fake diamond in the sky!!!
Fallen Kings
We are bond servants of Jesus Christ as Paul puts it clearly. The sons of God have been clearly twisted by the hyper charismatic word of faith (WOF) teachings of the 2 Kenneths ( Hagin and Copeland) to make us like ' little gods'.
Pentecostals today have truly departed from the true word of God and sound doctrines adhered to by the classical Pentecostals. Pentecostals and WOF charismatic today is one and same thing. No thanks to Oral Roberts who endorsed the teachings of Kenneth Hagin, the father of charismatics.
Kenneth Copeland, Creflo Dollar and many other WOF teachers emphasize the full meaning of the believers status as a child of God through Christ by equating it with being like "little gods ". Kenneth Copeland teaches that as little gods we can command God to obey us and do things we want as in name and claim.He says all Christians are co-equal with God like Jesus Christ who should not think it robbery to be called equal with God.
And many pastors swallow blindly such false teachings showing an absence of discernment on their part and then gurgitate them out for their sheep to swallow.And sad to say, many will devour these teachings without hesistation.Brethen, we need to continue to speak out and warn others who will listen.
Grace & Peace to all out there working to earn our daily bread.In spite of how disappointed you are with Church and God- dont forget to read "Our Daily Bread" sometime when you are free. For those of you who do not susbribe to it- you can just Google "Our Daily Bread" and there is a daily message there which can be read in 30 seconds.Oswald Chambers says " Let the past sleep in the bosom of Christ." God guide us all. Peace be unto you!!!
"Let the past sleep in the bosom of Christ" Can't seem to find the appropriate write up in Our Daily Bread. But definitely we need to let the past sleep and bury our sins, hurts and guilt at the foot of the cross where Christ has dealt with it completely. But arrogance, wrongs and false teachings cannot simply be ignored and allowed to perpetuate and continue to trample and damage the body of Christ.That would be condoning and partnering with errors and wrongs and disregarding its consequences on the church.
'....contend earnestly for the faith which was once for all handed down to the saints'Jude v3
'But even if we, or an angel from heaven, should preach to you a gospel contrary to what we have preached to you, he is to be accursed. As we have said before, so I say it again now, if any man is preaching to you a gospel contrary to what you received, he is to be accursed' Gal 1:8-9. Note that Paul repeated the warnings and curse in v9 immediately after v 8. That's how serious it is.
Let the past sleep in the bosom of Christ" Can't seem to find the appropriate write up in Our Daily Bread
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A little clarification - I wrote,
Oswald Chambers says " Let the past sleep in the bosom of Christ." God guide us all. Peace be unto you
This quote is found in his book "My Utmost for His Highest"
Its midweek already and before we know it- another week has slipped by.God sustain us all.
THE LATEST DIRECTIVE FROM THE GOVERMENT OF SINGAPORE
The latest directive from the Goverment of Singapore to its various Departments is not to employ people who have tattoos on their bodies-this especially covers the police, military , teaching personnel and important Goverment posts.It is not unlikely, that the private sectors will follow suit too.
I want to say something to the Christian youth of today.Lets face the reality of our existence.We may be described as citizens of heaven but we still have to live here on planet earth and work for someone for our livelihood.
Then - the political reality. Most of the high paying prestigious Goverment positions are not reserved for Christians. It is reserved for the ruling class. So many of you youth may have to find employment in our neighbour country.They have employed many Malaysians and for that we are grateful to God and to Singapore.
What I want to say here is this- dont jeopardize your employment chances by scarring your body. A proper career is more important than many colourful decorations on the body.
I see many youth in church today with colourful tattoos.I did not claim this to be a message from God. As a Christian brother- I felt this needed to be said in a practical context.
GOD BLESS/
Problem with tatoos is that it's permanent. Should you change your views about it at a later stage, it's too late. Stuck with it for life unless you want to cut off your flesh, leaving an ugly scar to remind you constantly of your folly in flirting with the world in order to be seen as trendy.
The pastors should be warning the sheep more against following blindly the worldly trends but instead they choose to focus on money and money, making the sheep feel guilty that they are not giving enough. PRESSURING people to give is worlds apart from having faith that God will provide, in fact it is actually a sign of lack of faith in God.
I dont think the AOG leopards are going to change their spots anytime soon.No preaching against divorces & tattoos and the late nightlife.They wont preach against divorce because these people contribute financialy and the church cannot afford to lose them.So they got to tone down the message but hit out against smoking and drinking.
These AOG Reverends just follow the trend because the Word Of God is only in their minds not in their convictions. All they desire is to find ways to collect more more money and put up another miserable building. Right now as I write, there are still many churches with the money appeal.And it wont end.Others Reverends are lying low,since now the spotlight is on them.
The AOG system is diseased. Lets get back to Bible study and godly fellowship.10 years ago, the Bible study in our church- 3/4 of the Sunday congregation will be there. Today in many churches Bible study has been cancelled- except when a " Special Speaker" is around.Like the bernard Blessings. Many of these AOG Reverends need to seriously re-think they involvement in Gods vineyard. and start seeking the will of God.
My pastor should step down and do what he really wants to do- instead of talking politics all the day along.What a misguided and lost man.
Fed Up
MY PASTORS DAILY SCHEDULE [ BEFORE THIS BLOG WAS BIRTHED]
9.30 PUNCH CARD AT TEH TARIK TABLE FOR BREAKFAST
10.30 STILL AT THE TT TABLE LAZING AROUND [ DESCRIBED BY HIM AS NEW TESTAMENT FELLOWSHIP]
11.00 HIS FRIEND ARRIVES
12.30 PASTORS FELLOWSHIP STILL GOES ON AT TT
1.00 THEY GO TO LUCH SOMEWHERE
3.30. RETURNS AND GOES TO OFFICE[USUALLY ON THE PHONE OR THE COMPUTER]
4.14 BACK AT THE TT - TEA BREAK
5 PM- GOES TO PICK UP HIS WIFE FROM WORK.
[THIS IS THE BEST TIME TABLE IN THE WHOLE WORLD]
BUT NOWADAYS HE SEEMS OT BE BUSY IN THE OFFICE WITH SOME KIND OF WORK.A LITTLE IMPROVEMENT ON THE SERMONS THOUGH.
SP claimed in his sermon that they are "sons of God" and not "servants of God."
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A COMMENT ON THE ABOVE
Of course, who wants to be known as a servant these days? Mention servants, and immediately some foreign maids come to mind.
Servants in church are very very rare these days. The various Titles pre-fixed before the Pastors name is self-explanatory.
SP as an evangelist was a role model.But I believe he caused problems for himself because of his enormous ego. Sure he can talk- thats a gifting from God no doubt.But he just got greedy along the way and pride creeped in.
It is a difficult situation for CC sheep right now. If SP resigns( which is unlikely at this stage) then some sheep are bound to get emotional and start looking for a scapegoat to blame.You can imagine where the blame will fall.Some will fall on the axed 400, and some will fall on the bloggers here.
Finally, frankly speaking SP and Crew have become an eyesore to many of us.They should just move on and do what they really want to do, instead of still hanging around in church with their circus comedies.Perhaps the songs sound spiritual enough, but the underlying tone is the same' Money,Money Money- Please bring in more money,OR God wont bless us......Bring in the sacrificial giving, love offerings, brick offerings, fasting offerings, special offerings,pastors offerings and dont forget the tithes and the pledges without decreasing the others.........
Jerusalem has become a prostitute abd defiled herself....
(Ezekiel)
Bernard Blessing. Did the leaders of the church show any humility and apologise for their carelessness and gullibilty concerning this "prophet", or was pride and arrogance in control that they feel they don't owe the church any explanation and just let them find out for themselves. That will tell the kind of character and personality of the leadership.
But they will not for one moment hesitate in pleading and pressuring for more money to finance their grandious dream building.
HE'S A PARIAH PASTOR
Thats how my wife described our ex-Pastor.Although he was already married he managed to get close to one weak willed lady in the church and the next thing- a scandal broke out.When the affair became known,the lady was devastated and is still in depression when we last met her in December 2011 at her home.The Pastor's wife got angry and seperated until this day.
And the Pastor?? Claimed that it was just platonic and that Satan was using others to slander him.Tried to talk,then threathen his way out by quoting many Bible verses.Finally he got booted out. But the damage was done and it cast a shadow over the whole church.And the sheep began to see the AOG REV aka "Gods anointed"[his favourite message] through new eyes.
I do not worry about single AOG Pastors.We must look at all the scandals of the AOG fellowship.ALL OF THEM WERE THE WORK OF PASTORS WHO WERE ALREADY MARRIED- Not Single people.Single pastors just date and get married.
But married Rev's sow their wild oats while hiding behind the appearance of a happily married man.
WOE UNTO YOU PHARISEES, WHO FOR A PRETENCE MAKE LONG PRAYERS BUT CREEP INTO WIDOW'S HOUSES.....[somewhere in Matthew]
We are now attending an Independant Church which is NOT presided by a single REV.titled person, but by a group of ELDERS- all in their 50's and 60's/ The Church Accounts are audited and pasted on the Church Notice Board every year- unlike in the AOG system where money matters are always shrouded in mystery- as is the case with SP & CC.
FAREWELL
A)…can someone out there please tell me how I can become an AOG Rev?? I earn only RM3,500 and only enough for food and pay the bills...
Hi brother, if you are in CC, deduct 10% of tithes and u r left with RM3150(read: it is compulsory otherwise you suffer and God no bless you as PO so specifically rebuked at MCA hall last Dec Christmas presentation);
Ah yes faith promise...deduct at least another 10%?...now left with RM2800 (read: it is also must if you want God's blessing as implied by the APs like RY, PO, n of course SP... again it has to be sacrificially...no peanuts n no leftovers!!)
Oh yes, not forgetting other contributions like CARNIVAL tickets, buy a brick, etc where being goody goody n obedient sheep u r expected to sacrifice time, energy n OF COURSE RM..RM n MORE RM...(read:just give...give n give...to quote DS in cheras..."give even if you r in want...no worry...as God will surely bless". i wonder if he DS practise what he so twistedly preached)
Fortunately, one blogger so timely reminded readers that Biblically, the head of the family must be responsible and provide for his family.
Btw for Carnival 2012 each CC members better raise at least RM1000.00! ( based on abt 700 members and another 700? associate members as the target is RM1.5 million)
Also, don't forget to reserve substantially for CC pastors' and outreach workers' Christmas gifts. To quote RY2 in cheras on 04/12/2012 "...BE GENEROUS!!!"
Ah…Sunday offering is also important. Again as PO amd RY has reminded the cheras sheep so many many times. Sunday offering is not tithes. Don’t substitute one giving for another!! And again no peanuts and leftovers. What you give is an indication of your faith!!!
Well, what's the balance now?
YOU THINK THEY(SP, APs n THE BOD) CARE if you are trying to make ends meet??
I THINK THEY DON'T EVEN REMEMBER YOUR NAME UNLESS YOU ARE A SUBSTANTIAL CONTRIBUTOR FINANCIALLY. I personally experience it.
B) Anonymous wrote…I dont think the AOG leopards are going to change their spots anytime soon.No preaching against divorces & tattoos and the late nightlife.
Yes, you can add other vices like gambling to that list.
Sometime last year during one of my regular teh tarik sessions with two of my best childhood friends, A and B(both are potential believers, one of whom attended the Easter Presentation at Putra Stadium) , a church-going Christian sister from an AOG church joined us and soon became a regular.
This Christian sister started talking about her regular gambling trips to Genting Highlands and invited us to joined her. My two friends soon became her regular companions.
And now A having failed to get me to join them has managed to get three foreign workers (Myannars) working in a restaurant to join him! Sad to say the three are addicted; going up every Mondays(their off day)
Until today, A is still trying to get me to join him…and i quote “come on! give me one reason why u cannot gamble. S is from AOG church. You also from AOG church…she Christian, u Christian why cannot?...what men!!!”
I shared this with two senior/pioneer members of that church so they can discuss with their pastors to find some solution. And the replies I get is disgusting to say the least! This is some of the comments from them…”this is her personal thing, don’t judge, u have to be very careful/tactful if u want to bring it to pastors, better not, just leave it,….” And worst of all they laughed/sniggered it off as if it is such a trivial matter and why I even bothered!!!
Personally, this blog has brought so much enlightenment. Please keep it going.
GOD BLESS
ANOTHER SMALL FRY
Bernard Blessing. Did the leaders of the church show any humility and apologise ....
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RESPONSE TO THE ABOVE
Sometimes Pastors make mistakes too in inviting speakers.I am not going to blame them for that.Most of the speakers today know how to sell themselves by advertisement and through the Internet.And many are taken in.My main concern is for genuine Shepherds who do not use crafty methods to promote themselves but generally they are not known in the greater Body of Christ.Only the so called reverends are prominent.
I have heard Bernard Blessing speak in one of the local big churches.No doubt,he is great in exhortation and is an evangelist but all the miracles and prophecies were fake.So called healings of cancer and other diseases.The prophecies-I tell you truly,this guy is a loose cannon shooting off his mouth and giving people false hopes to church goers.
Most of the foreign speakers claim fantastic miracles through their ministry...but...but it all happened somewhere in Africa,village churches in China,India, Indonesia and perhaps on the moon.The result is that these so called miracles cannot be verified by the listeners.One speaker even claimed that God had used him to raise the dead..and a great silence fell on the church.After the service I approached him(which is usually an impossibility because of the crowd around him)and queried him about the name of the person who was raised from the dead.Can I have his email, any way I can contact him?
"Oh,God is using him in village churches and he does not carry a cell phone!!" was the reply%%
(Smile)
What was really bothersome to me was the state of mind of the sheep.The very atmosphere was filled with expectancy that something great was about to happen.Besides the pamphlets,the Pastors introduction about this great man of God contributed to the anticipation.
To be honest,the house is so vulnerable to deception.When the Anti- Christ appears, he will probably be welcome in the charismatic movements, as these groups tend to believe that if it is miracle- then it must be from God.
Lets face it.The CC episode is just the tip of the iceberg.There are many things hidden within church groups and God has already departed.
My personal opinion,with the moral decay so prevalent in society right now,the churches have to emphasize Bible study and prayer,and church fellowship.Pastors who try to monopolize church people should be gently shown the door by matured Christians.
Perverts and frauds-relating to church finances should be reported to the authorities.
THE SCORCHING WINDS ARE COMING.
The Church Accounts are audited and pasted on the Church Notice Board every year- unlike in the AOG system where money matters are always shrouded in mystery- as is the case with SP & CC.
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YOU THINK THE AOG CHURCHES ARE GOING TO DO THIS? YOU MUST BE JOKING..HA..HA.. THE CHINES HAVE A SAYING- IF YOU WANT TO HIDE YOUR EVIL WORKS- JOIN A RELIGIOUS ESTABLISHMENT-- NOBODY WILL SUSPECT YOU THEN.,...BYE..BYE...
"...Sometimes pastors make mistake too in inviting speakers.I am not going to blame them for that."
The question is not about the blame.It is whether they apologised, explained and warned the sheep after discovering they, as shepherds, have been deceived, failing in discernment, and not doing due deligence on the Bernard Blessings but instead were easily taken in by his miracle stories and inviting him back several times again. Does that not tell you the character and style of leadership-not humble enough to say sorry I err. After this can you now simply trust the leaders' judgement. Brethen, next time don't just swallow everything they say. Check against the Word of God like the Bereans.
Today at the 8:00am service,at DH, SK mentioned that last week PG said that "tsunamis that occur once awhile is good because it draws people closer to God".
A year ago when the massive earthquake took place in Japan, the Sunday edition of the internet newspaper News Mission reported David Yonggi Cho as saying "The earthquake makes me wonder if this was not God's warning."
Cho also said, "We in Korea look at Japan and think that at this juncture, more than a physical earthquake, it is in need of a holy spiritual earthquake."
The article triggered public rage, though the controversial comments were soon removed from the article. Netizens rushed to to accuse Cho of being blindly self-righteous and lacking the basic charitable virtues required of a religious leader. Jin Joong-gwon, a leading social critic, lashed back at Cho, calling the pastor a "lunatic".
Many internet users said it was inappropriate of Cho as a senior religious leader to make such demeaning remarks about the earthquake victims. One netizen said he feels ashamed of the pastor as a Christian himself, while other internet users vowed to sat away from the church if God punishes non-beliebers in such a manner as Cho said.
With PG also making such a controversial remark as above and also saying Christians are "not servants in the Kingdom of God", have we got a lunatic in our midst? Before the age of the internet, religious leaders and pastors can say whatever they want, criticize others or expound their own distorted interpretations of the bible, knowing full-well that no one will be able to object to their actions when they are on the pulpit. The internet transcends borders and internet users are free to voice their opinions to bring awareness to the whole wide world.
CT not only serves as platform for Calvarites and ex-Calvarites to express their views, it is also an avenue for Christians to share their experiences of misbehaving pastors or pastors distorting the bible with their self proclaimed anointing. CT, keep it up!
Prophecy fulfilled in USA !
Crystal Cathedral church sold its iconic glass-paned cathedral to the Roman Catholic Diocese of Orange last month to emerge from federal bankruptcy protection.
The church raked in millions in donations through its "Hour of Power" broadcasts, but a series of financial setbacks led to the megachurch's filing for bankruptcy in October 2010 and the forced sale of its 40-acre (16-hectare) campus.
Will the PROPHECY for CCC & Calvary Church be fulfilled in the near future ? Those gifted with Spiritual Discernment will know CCC & CC fate !
Help me, Lord, to reassure and strengthen Others by the words I speak today;I would always try to be affirming,As our pathways cross along life’s way. —Hess
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I was thinking about my ex-pastor when I read this. Many of the sheep scattered because of his fowl mouth- and a critical spirit.He got the disease of "Self Righteousness" found among AOG ministers.Some of the things that come out of his mouth is just so unbelievable.Always has the habit of whispering about other pastors moral failures- and he will talk about it to anyone who will listen.
The other Sunday he was at it again when he railed" Out of 5 pastors ...4 pastors fall away"
Later at home my husband and children asked me" Is he among the 4 or the exclusive one?It is obvious that he is exalting himself by this kind of preaching.
People go to church to hear God's Word being preached- not to listen to their personal crap!!! Is he a godly saint incapable of falling? If satan can fall...who are we? This is another example of a Rev. titled pastor who is just doing his own thing using the pulpit.It is a disgraceful state of affairs!!
Cheh!!! Cheh!!!
Anon @ March 10, 2012 1:37 PM.
Let's not paint every pastor and church with the same brush. My local church is an AG church and our accounts are audited by a registered public accounting firm and made available every year. Let's not paint pastor and church with the same brush. Peace.
To Anon @ March 13, 2012 5.26PM
The issues are integrity, transparency and Godly governance.
Calvary Church @ Damansara Heights, Kuala Lumpur too publishes beautifully bound accounts for many years but the accounts still lack truth, trust and transparency on important aspects of essential disclosure. During the AGM/EGM, microphones will be turned off when pertinent questions are raised. Pastors acting as securityguards (some like calling them night-club bouncers) will look at the questioners with menacingly to intimidate the questioners. The chair will follow with comments like "if you will not sit down..."
Go listen to some of the relevant tapes of the last several AGM/EGM if still unconvinced.
Crystal Cathedral. What ever happen to Robert Schuller's power of postive confession. Didn't work ? He was another disciple of Kenneth Hagin and his word of faith teachings. Oral Roberts endorses K Haggin. Joel Osteen and Cho Yonggi preach positive confession all the time.
You activate the power of faith through this formula:
Faith= Believe + Visualise + Positive Confession = Actualization.
I actually heard with my own ears, one WOF preacher who even insulted the single women for failing to find life partners simply because they fail to activate their faith. You are supposed to visualise your prospective husband everyday in the mirror. Reminds me of the fairy tale.....mirror mirror on the wall.
And has God no choice but to honour that faith formula? As a child we were taught to pray in simple faith and trust God to answer us as He sees best which is YES, No or WAIT. But now, the childlike faith has been replaced by a more sophisticated fomula. What ever happen to God's sovereignty? Usurped by the WOF formula ?
"...Let's not paint every pastor...." Agree with you but don't worry, not all pastors ( AOG or otherwise) eat chillis, so they won't feel hot. Peace.
Let's not paint every pastor and church with the same brush...
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I totally agree with the above blogger.Many of us out here in the secular world feel greatly saddened by some of the contents of this blog.Should this blog be discontinued? Before we attempt to answer this question,we have to ask another question- Why was this blog birthed in the first place? What made Christians come here? As far as I know, Christians are peaceable people,and would not go the second mile to ruffle others- much less find the time to blog here.[Demon possessed are excused]
If the truth be told,there are many hurt and wounded Christians out here. What is most disturbing is that these Christians were hurt by other Christians and that too within the 4 walls of the church.And there seems to be no remedy.
Can Christian leaders behave high handedly against the sheep and get away with it? Recently Cho Yonggi came under fire for suggesting that the tsunami that hit Japan may have caused a spiritual awakening.
The Malays have a word to describe this attitude- "SUDAH NYANYOK"(mental disability has set in due to "senileness"]
Of course, there is a reason why Malaysian Pastors are quiet in the face of this obviously stupid utterances by Chonggi.If the tsunami had hit Malaysia and we had lost family,friends and relatives & paralyzed our churces and business-then maybe we will shout against this Christian leader.
Pastors need to realize that we have entered a new season.To be expecting the sheep to quietly tolerate the pastoral abuses of previous generations is to miscalculate church people today.
The Internet is a reality today, and there is no church OR political system on earth today that can stop it.If any authority bans it- then there always the hackers who find the cracks.
SP and disgraceful team should just seek out the scattered sheep and make attempts to heal the breach.He has not done that- instead he is just as usual strolling on stage because it is "his show". I personally feel that he and his "yes men" should do the right thing and just move on instead of hogging the limelight and harping on the new CCC.
There is hardly any point in critisizing the bloggers here.Their voices were shouted down within church- so let them speak here.For once-lets hear them instead of speaking a spiritual sounding statement "Forgive and forget Loh!!!Thats downright insensitive and stupid to say the least.
Grace & Peace to you all.
The Crystal Cathedral is an example of extravagant spending. Instead of focussing on building the TRUE house of God (which is the the body of Christ)and laying the right foundation and structures of faith and sound doctrines in the Word of God, Robert Schuller chose to build a grandious building he calls 'the house of God' Now instead of passing down sound faith to the next generation, he passes on huge debts and false teachings.
The English proverb has come to pass: 'a fool and his money is soon parted.'
Only thing is that he is not the fool because it is not his money but that of the gullible members.
Will the next generation of your church inherit a rich heritage of sound faith and doctrine built upon the Word of God, or will they inherit huge debts and a concrete buiding they call 'church'?
The Crystal Cathedral is now for the tourists to admire but to the Christians, it should be a constant reminder of human folly, his attempt to pass off his personal human dreams and ambitions as divine vision.
Today at the 8:00am service,at DH, SK mentioned that last week PG said that "tsunamis that occur once awhile is good because it draws people closer to God".
Prince Guneratnam hopes to collect another offering...........
Not to help the Tsunami victims but .....
To transfer the funds to his personal ministry !!
HE DID THAT !!!!!
I still remember the illustration by a pastor that sees the church like some corporate enterprise. We are MacDonalds and they are KFC. You don't eat in MacDonalds and pay in KFC (even though we are the same body of Christ). Whoa, the church is now in business. Some in MacDonalds and some in KFCs. No wonder many of them adopted corporate style of management with a vision and mission statements etc and some even have a CEO pastors. All I am aware of is that the Bible only talks about leaders as servants of God and the church as the Body of Christ. So when the church begins to behave like a corporation, you know they have been influenced and overtakened by by the culture of the world instead of the other way around.
Isn't there already a basic structure now present in bkt jalil.
God's grace and peace to all of you- I have been reading your blogs and learning so much that is being confirmed happening in many places of the world. In Ephesians 4:11-13 the five-fold ministry of apostles, prophets, evangelists, pastors and teachers was given to serve the church: "For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ: Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fullness of Christ: That we henceforth be no more children, tossed to and fro, and carried about with every wind of doctrine, ...But speaking the truth in love, may grow up into him in all things, which is the head, even Christ... This is the only 1 mention of the word 'pastors' in New Testament with their job description.
Pastors are mentioned 8x's in Jeremiah, 7x's in negative sense of not doing their job, but instead don't care for them, scatter them, take advantage of them, etc. Jeremiah 23:1 says, "Woe be unto the pastors that destroy and scatter the sheep of my pasture! saith the Lord." We are certainly living in the last days of great apostasy in the church.
In Mt 24:13 Jesus says to us, "But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved."
Let us encourage one another to be true worshippers who worship God in spirit and in truth (John 4:23). - Sister from Hawaii
Posted by Anonymous to Calvary Today at March 16, 2012 3:39 PM
Some pastors insist that because their work is a divine calling, they don't have a retirement age. Then please read this divine command to the Levites: "But at the age of fifty years they shall retire from service in the work and not work anymore.They shall however assist their brothers in the tent of meeting....."(Num 8:25)
If they say OT Levitical laws don't apply anymore after Calvary, then how is it that they love to scare the sheep by reminding them of the OT Levitical laws concerning tithes in Malachi, but not remind themselves of this OT command about retirement? Is this not a case of cherry picking verses to suit their needs?
You are exactly correct about all the cherry picking going on! If those pastors want to demand tithes, then they have to follow all the OT laws on second tithe, tithe of tithes, many kinds of food offerings, feast days, etc. Not counting not eating shrimp and crab, my favorite foods, and men not cutting their hair and shaving off their whiskers! Can't imagine what my husband would look like!!! There's lots more OT laws which we are not bound to, after all we are NT believers. Whom the Lord has set free is free indeed! Amen to that!
Posted by Anonymous to Calvary Today at March 18, 2012 10:08 AM
then how is it that they love to scare the sheep by reminding them of the OT Levitical laws concerning tithes in Malachi..
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THE CAT,I THINK,IS OUT OF THE BAG......
Of course- we are no more under the law. But when it concerns $$$... suddenly the AOG Rev.insists that we are under the Mosaic law- put in the offering- or you are under Gods curse.For ages, the AOG system have spun lies and now it is showing.This is indeed a shameful way to earn a living.Since under the OT law, most of the tithes goes to the maintenance of the Levitical Priesthood-- the modern day tithing goes to the maintenance of these deluded preachers. Of course, the worker is worthy of his wages, but to get it by inducing feelings of guilt in the sheep, and by misquoting the Scriptures....> I do not believe that these preachers are ignorant.Its just that they so soaked with lies in this area and they themselves are the product of the system.
Which AOG Rev. would dare say that the tithing system is obsolete? I think his fellow AOG cons would immediately swoop down on him and finish him off.It's a bread and butter issue for them.
Leave them alone, they are blind guides to the blind.
MY BARKING PASTOR
That is exactly how my pastor sounds like when he is preaching.The youth just have to put up with him silently.He just does not know when to stop--just rails on and on.Jesus this and Jesus that.This morning it was against Gady Gaga.Why cant he go the the US and say it in her face instead of screaming against the social ills within the church?? It is just so sickening!!!
Many Christians today don't study the Word of God for themselves but just swallow what the pastor dish out each Sunday.When it comes to the Mosaic law and grace, they are all confused. After Calvary, we are completely under grace and the only laws that are still applicable are those pertaining to moral laws in step with our walk in Christ. The Mosaic laws pertaining to ceremonial, levitical rules and laws centred on Israel and the worship in the Tabernacle has now been replaced by the grace of God through Christ and we now worship in spirit and truth.
Therefore today's teaching on tithes is rather strange. It's just a new invention, unbiblical and is neither 1) Pre Mosaic tithes 2) Mosaic tithes or 3) NT .
High time some honest pastor in Malaysia speak the truth wihout fearing that they are throwing sand onto their own rice bowl. They preach faith alot, so don't they have faith that God will always provide for them.
The crunch is here now at CC. Today, SK announced that the church had draw RM14 mil under the loan facility and the interest is RM70k a month. His hair will drop faster now and the others in the finance committee will see more white hairs.
The Faith promise for March stands at RM194,538. The collection for Week 2 is only RM64,400.
The impact of TOTT is clearly seen. Keep the TOTT momentum going.
"then how is it that they love to scare the sheep by reminding them of the OT Levitical laws concerning tithes in Malachi.."
Don't let anyone scare you, 2Tim 1:7: For God hath not given us the spirit of fear; but of POWER, and of LOVE, and of a SOUND MIND". Fear comes from Satan who wants to frighten, intimidate, and frustrate the plan of God for our lives. He steals our joy when God wants us to experience His love and blessings; Satan wants to kill and destroy us and take us to hell: "The thief comes to steal, kill and destroy, but I (Jesus) am come to give you life and life more abundantly" (John 10:10 Who are you going to believe? Stand on the Word of God, "SUBMIT yourself to God, to His Word; RESIST the devil and he will FLEE from you."
You have to be TOUGH if you are still at CC because "where there is envying and strife, there is confusion and every evil work" (James 3:16) That last part means Satan is working overtime in your church.
Encourage others; we're living in the last days of end time prophecies being fulfilled. Your church or even my church situation isn't going to get better so we have to remind ourselves that our faith and hope is in Jesus, who is our Lord and Savior. When push comes to shove, the apostle Peter said in Acts 5:29, "we ought to obey God rather than man." Let the Holy Spirit give you discernment and teach you what is truth and what is error. -Sis. fr. Hawaii
Posted by Anonymous to Calvary Today at March 19, 2012 7:01 AM
Agree with Sis fr Hawaii ".......we're living in the last days of end times prophecies being fulfilled...." Exactly correct. In the last day another gospel will be preached like the gospel focussing on prosperity, money, silver and gold ( which Peter had none) and other destructive doctrines eg emergent, spirituality etc. "But false prophets also arose among the people, just as there will also be false teachers among you, who will secretly introduce destructive heresies...." 2Pet 2:2
The truth is under assault in the church today. The sheep is bombarded with unbiblical and extrabiblical teachings everyday. The busy christians have no time to search scriptures like the Bereans do but just swallow every teaching and wind of doctrine. Pastors no longer regard themselves as servant pastors/ shepherds but as celebrity pastors and CEOs. We are constantly warned and reminded to beware of such different gospels( Gal 1:6-9)
And what should we do. Remain unconcerned? Pretend it don't exist and it will go away? Pretend it won't do damage to the body of Christ or deceive believers? The answer is clearly written in the bible and that is : "... CONTEND earnestly for the faith which was once for all handed down to the saints" (Jude3) And the prosperity teachings on tithes is definitely one of them. As pointed out in a comment above it is neither pre Moasaic, Mosaic law or NT teachings. Just a new unbiblical teachings popular especially with the silver and gold preachers.
"let the Holy Spirit give you discernment and teach you what is truth and what is error". Yes, and the Holy Spirit who is our divine teacher will teach us and illuminate our hearts with the truth that is WRITTEN IN GOD's INSPIRED SCRIPTURES and through His illumination of the WRITTEN WORD we will be able to discern the unbiblical, extrabiblical and that which is erroneous. " All Scripture is inspired by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, for training in righteousness so that the man of God may be adequate, equipped for every good work." (2Tim 3:16-17)
CONTEND FOR THE FAITH.
THE AOG HOUSE IS BUILT ON THE SAND
I think by now it is quite clear that most of the teachings found in the AOG cannot be supported from the Scriptures. Tithing is never taught in the entire NT.Neither did any minister in the entire NT crown himself/herself with a Rev. title.That title is only reserved for God.
The CC episode has brought many things into the searchlight of the Holy Scriptures.True there are genuine Shepherds around but that in no way justifies the twisting of the Scriptures.
SP has lost credibility. And he is not listening. Recently even Sharizat and Husband had to attend Court to answer charges.It appears that non- Christians have more accountability than the Christians.And these pastors are behaving as though they are above the law.
If SP was a man of truth, he would have personally gone to Court to answer the charges. Instead he used his Assisting Clown to make the appearance while he sat in the shadows.It is high time that he woke up from his slumber and from his make believe world that he is some kind of Royalty.
TOTT is working wonderfully. All so called reverends take a lesson from this saga.If you start kicking around the sheep whilst hiding behind a religious mask- then just a bit of advice FOR YOU HERE- there may be some goats with strong horns grazing alondside the sheep- and they may not take your crap lying down.
BYE FOR NOW.
fed up , human using church and God for their own agenda. after a while you suppose what you do in church or related to church are of God, wake up , make your fortune elsewhereLAH...shanghai, LA , new york, london , milan , .....
Posted by jamsborn to Calvary Today at March 19, 2012 10:37 PM
jamsborn, this blog is not against the church but is simply contending for the faith. We speak only against false teachings that are unbiblical and contradict the Word of God. We make a stand for accountability and transparency in the management of the church's finances and other resources. We only want the church to channel its finances and resources in the direction that is consistent with its biblical calling and that is to fulfil the Great Commission (ie make and build disciples) minister to the poor, widows and orphans and the needy and in the direction that glorifies God and lead many to the saving knowledge and grace of Jesus Christ. We stand against irresponsible and extravagant spending on glamorious projects that puff up human egos and fulfil human dreams that win the applause of man. We desire to pass on a heritage of biblical faith to the next generation and not debts and unbiblcal teachings.
To Anonymous, March 16, 4.50pm.,
You stated: Isn't there already a basic structure now present in bkt jalil.
I would like to know what does this signifies to you?
A completed CCC does not means anything but the fact that it is the result of spiritual abuse of the church leaders(shepherds) on many(not a few)members(sheep)who stood(still stand)for truth, transparency and godly government.
LIES WITHIN THE AOG SYSTEM
We are all saved by God's grace and are no more under the law of Moses....we don't have to practice the Levitical laws ANY MORE..Amen???.NO more blood sacrifices....Amen??blah...blah...Praise God.....He has set us free from the Law of Moses!!!...Amen.Hallelujah!!! Alleluia....Halleluhah!!! can we all SHOUT the loudest Amen?? I can't hear you!!! HALLELUJAH!!! I still cant hear you!!!! HALLELUYAH!!!AMEN AND OH MAN!!!
but however.....THE CHRISTIAN still have to pay tithes and offerings BECAUSE in the Book Of Malachi........yes in the Old Testament... this law this applies to Christians today....because...because....[ money is still money]
ITS HIGH TIME THE AOG SYSTEM STOPS THIS BULLSHIT AND PREACH THE TRUTH TO THE CONGREGATION. CHEERIO!! HAPPY PREACHING.
Anonymous (March 20, 1.27PM):
Apology for the last word, wrongly worded: it should be " governance" and not "government".
Godly government is also my hope too.
To out of control blogger:
People of credibility exercise intelligence and self control when expressing themselves. Nearly all blogs ban obscene words and profanity and require decorum /good behavior to join in. Get a hold of yourself and and improve your vocabulary to participate in this blog. Your BS's and ranting and raving show that you have no class, but display a poor Christian testimony, if you are a Christian. The moderator should ban your posts!
Agree with Anonymous March 21, 2012 1:41AM. All who wish to comment, please avoid use of crude words. Expressing strong views and making a strong stand and speaking up on financial issues in the church, or contending against against unbiblical teachings is legitimate. But we should exercise self control and avoid name calling or make crude remarks on the person. Be angry with what is taught or done by the person if you must, but don't hate the person. Criticise but also pray for them.
While I feel uneasy about some crude words used, I am quite relieved that non were really in the category of obsence words like what you often read in local news blogs. I also feel strongly that the church leadership should lead by example and not act in high handed ways or abuse the pulpit to rant against those that disagree with what they teach or do. Otherwise it's worst than the pot calling the kettle black. That's because the church pastors and leadership have an even greater God given responsibility to display christian character and testimony and be a role model to the sheep. Or are the sheep of no concerned to them?
People of credibility exercise intelligence and self control when expressing themselves.
................................................RESPONSE TO THE ABOVE [I did not write the BS blog]
It is the above kind of attitude that has exarcebated the abuses at CCC.When the 400 were axed we had to exercise self control,when a long time sister was humiliated and ushered to the door,again we had to exercise self control, when microphones were rudely turned off when members were asking legitimate questions,of course we had to exercise self control again.Now that SP and crew had conflicted their earlier statements by saying that we have to pay 70k a month, we have to excercise self control.I mean no disrespect,this is not an issue about self control- but the right word is stupidity.And the Tuan/ Puan has to wake up.Period.
Of course,it is easy for this blogger to be hiding behind an anonymous name here and asking for diplomacy.Just for the record,he has neither used profanity or obscenity here.My colleagues here at office scrutinize what anybody writes before we send out anything. In that sense,I think he has more accountability here than what goes on at CC.
Judging by your blog, you seem to say that people should express themselves properly.But throughout the sordid CC episode, I never heard your voice, even remotely, protesting against the high handed dealings of SP and gang. Instead you have come here with your " Get a hold of yourself crap..."Did you tell the same thing to SP and gang? He really needs to hear this kind of advice from you.Go up to him after the service this Sunday and please say it if you meant what you wrote here.We will be watching.Do it on behalf of all the sheep that SP has scattered.
Lastly look at the following Scriptures and see whether they fall within your moral requirements of intelligence & self control you mentioned in this blog.
"Woe unto you Pharisees, Woe unto you Bethsaida, Woe unto you Chorazin, Woe unto you lawyers....
Titus
"One of themselves, even a prophet of their own said, The Cretians are always liars, evil beasts, slow bellies.This witness is true. Wherefore rebuke them sharply, that they may be sound in the faith;
Dear Tuan/Puan- does the above sound like the speakers are exersing self control and intelligence when they expressed themselves in this manner? Reflect.Nothing personal here.I did not see any malice in the thoughts of blogger.Grace & Peace be to you all.
March 21,2012 2:59PM.
Well said brother. Waiting for him to utter those words to the pastor and church leaders.
I believe that the editors are matured enough to analyze the contents of a blogger before they decide to make it public.Sure,some people expressly themselves harshly here.Bruised emotions no doubt.But we must look beyond the words used and discern the hurts,wounds,frustrations and sense of betrayals behind this messages.They are our brothers and sisters- and in different stages of spiritual growth.It behooves the matured believers to listen. There are many people out there in society these days deeply wounded by loved ones.But its greatly saddening if Christians are wounded within a church by high titled preachers.
I think many pastors have greatly benefitted from the many writeups in this blog.For one thing,it may have prevented them from throwing their weight around in church because of their superior Bible knowledge.
The events at CC should never have happened. But it has.And healings' in the hearts of believers cannot take place when the wrongs are not put right.And the collective leadership of the AOG system are helpless or plainly indifferent.It has put the system to the test too.It is my prayer that the wrongs will be put right this year so that the healings can take place at CC.It is no shame to say "I have sinned against heaven and against you.I am no more worthy to be called your leader" Remember David's prayer after his adultery and murder.Until the day he owned up to his own sin and transgressions- there was no healing.
Someday SP and circus team must come to themselves.They must take responsibility for their actions.Only then the healing can begin at CC.
" I am the Lord that heals you" has little reference to situations like the above.
So then,confess your sins to one another and pray for one another,so that you may be healed. James 5:16
Maybe SP and circus team have to start looking for another job.Presumably in the business world.
GRIEVED
Today at the 8:00am service,at DH, SK mentioned that last week PG said that "tsunamis that occur once awhile is good because it draws people closer to God....
..............................................
HOPEFULLY HIS PERSONAL TSUNAMI DRAWS HIM CLOSER TO GOD...
"Instead you have come here with your " Get a hold of yourself crap..."Did you tell the same thing to SP and gang? He really needs to hear this kind of advice from you.Go up to him after the service this Sunday and please say it if you meant what you wrote here.We will be watching.Do it on behalf of all the sheep that SP has scattered.."
I certainly would speak to SP and gang, if I could and if the Lord would speak to me to do so! But could I speak to you first? Also want to say that Jesus was always in full control, so was Paul as he wrote in his epistles to Timothy, to Titus... They spoke out of the spirit of wisdom and knowledge which was God-given. Last thing, I want to say to you is that it is hard to understand that we are not fighting with one another, but it is Satan who is our adversary, who seeks to destroy the church of God and the believers in Jesus Christ. Take care, brother and God bless!
Posted by Anonymous to Calvary Today at March 22, 2012 5:07 AM
FROM THE "BS" BLOGGER
but however.....THE CHRISTIAN still have to pay tithes and offerings BECAUSE in the Book Of Malachi
...........................................
I AM THE AUTHOR OF THE ABOVE WHICH CONTAINS THE WORD "BS".I WANT TO APOLOGIZE FOR WHAT I WROTE AS I WAS FRUSTRATED.I HOPE I DID NOT HURT OR OFFEND ANYONE OUT HERE.LETS BLOG RESPONSIBLY.REGARDS.I AM GRATEFUL TO GOD FOR MY BROTHERS AND SISTERS.
"Last thing,I want to say.........that we are not fighting one another, but satan who is our adversary."
Exactly, but you cannot fight the common adversary by remaining silent and doing nothing. The bible exhorts us to earnestly contend for the faith (Jude 3). In this blog when many contend for the faith against false teachings and doctrines , when they speak against injustice and high handed actions by leaders and when they seek accountability and transparency they are not fighting one another, but satan who is the common adversary. They speak up very strongly against such things and they hate false doctrines taught by pastors and leaders but they don't hate the persons. Brothers and sisters continue to speak up and contend earnestly for the faith but pray for the leaders.
To the brother who used the BS word. Bravo, it takes guts and alot of humility to admit and apologise. Many of us including pastors and leaders can learn from you. But keep speaking up. Don't let one slip discourage you from standing up for the truth.
Thank you for the last three posts. I really appreciate all of the words which you've shared with me. I truly empathize with your sufferings and share your burdens. A few years ago I myself was deeply involved in a church crisis and my committee members and myself were uncompromising in our stand. We were not appreciated, but mistreated by our brethren. We were released from our responsibilities, I, a church administrator was fired, not before I was named in a suit which was dropped a year later. This is only a short report of the ugly activities that go on in more churches than we can imagine. Through the difficult church board meetings we presented facts and maintained our integrity. Within 2 years the SP resigned, followed by the AP, and the chairman of the board the key person who fueled the opposition against us died from kidney failure. It took almost another 2 years for me to put the bad memories behind me, but my former committee members and I have chosen to forgive those misguided members who sided against us and we remain in our church, all by the grace of God.
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